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Does Room Need Closet To Be A Bedroom?

Discussion in 'General Appraisal Discussion' started by NC Values, Dec 4, 2004.

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  1. NC Values

    NC Values Sophomore Member

    0
    Feb 21, 2003
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    North Carolina
    In completing the room counts on a URAR for a convention new home sale, does a room need to have a closet to be counted as a bedroom? Also, what is the distinction between a finished attic and 3rd level rooms on a 2-1/2 story home?

    Im apraising new 4000sf home that has a "guest room" on main level with adjoining full bath, but no closets in the guest room. Also, 3rd level has 2 rooms and 1 full bath, is heated & cooled, carpeted, and drywall with similar finish to lower levels, but light is limited to single windows on each gable end and sloped ceilings. 2nd room on this level could be used as bedroom, but like the guest room, lacks a closet.
     
  2. Fred

    Fred Elite Member

    0
    Jan 15, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Retired Appraiser
    State:
    Virgin Islands
    I think NAHb, ANSI, FNMA, FHA, etc., have various guidlines. For example, I think ANSI says a ceiling has to be at least 7 feet high for anything to be a room. But all such stuff should be termpered with common sense and market analysis.

    Then again, some houses have shoe closets that are bigger than "bedrooms."
     
  3. Richard Carlsen

    Richard Carlsen Elite Member

    0
    Jan 15, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Licensed Appraiser
    State:
    Michigan
    Absolutely not.

    Thousands upon thousands of of houses have been built in this country no closets in the bedrooms. Very few of the old farm houses I do have closets in the majority of the bedrooms. People had fewer clothes and used wardrobes.

    What is the functional utility of the room? Bedroom you say. Can people sleep in it without having a place to put their clothes? Of course they can. Then it must be a bedroom.
     
  4. Liz Mura

    Liz Mura Member

    0
    Oct 20, 2004
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    Arizona
    I would agree that older homes often did not have closets and that would be expected by the typical buyer of this kind of home. I lived in a 175 year old cobblestone that did not originally have any closets in the bedrooms, but they were very large rooms and closets were built to accomodate current tastes and needs (not many people use wardrobes today). I would think a NEW house should be functional to the demands of the current buyer. Yes, you could sleep in that room, but if you have guests come in for a week to stay in your "guest room", where will they hang all their clothes? On the bathroom curtain rod? I guess it depends on room count. If you have a 5 bedroom house and one of those bedrooms doesn't have a closet, there's no huge loss of value as you still have four bedrooms. In a smaller home, I have called it a "den" and said it could be "converted" (closet added) to a bedroom if needed and not subtracted any value.
    I would probably call that 3rd half a story just a finished attic and separate it out from the gross living area (even though well finished) as it is not as functional as the rest of the home...not as well lit, sloped ceilings. Not many people want to trudge up 2 full flights of stairs to their bedroom, guests or owners. Good place to store the kids, though! :p Of course, this is all just my opinion. Good luck.
    Liz
     
  5. Tony in Ohio

    Tony in Ohio Member

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    Jan 15, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    Ohio
    All good points above,


    In your case.... it depends. :beer:

    At 4000 SF(new) its probably a den/office with potential for use as a 5th/6th bedroom or inlaw/retirement suite if needed. They build them without closets for flexibility. If the owner wants to use it as a den/office the full bath is a little bit of an over improvement. If they want to use it as a bedroom suite, a closet can be built or a wardrobe purchased for a grand or so. Probably not significant in the price range.


    Most realtors in my market would list it as a bedroom and most buyers would see it as one.... even if they were going to use it as a den/office.
     
  6. Anthem

    Anthem Senior Member

    0
    Mar 10, 2004
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    North Carolina
    Agree with Tony,
    in our county it is not considered a bedroom without a closet, it is considered a Den.
     
  7. moh malekpour

    moh malekpour Elite Member

    0
    May 25, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California
    If there was a room with no closet and no bathroom addjoining to it, I wouldn't consider it a bedroom but since there is a bathroom next or adjoining to it, then it is a bedroom because a bathroom without a bedroom has no useful utility in the main floor and if there is a bedroom in the main floor but no bath in the same floor, that bedroom has not much functionality even with a closet.
    I have seen closet that is in the bathroom dressing area and I have seen closet that is in the hallway outside the bedroom and I have seen clost that is only a rod on the angle of two walls and I have seen closet that is like a bookshelf.
     
  8. CANative

    CANative Elite Member

    268
    Jun 18, 2003
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California
    I guess the question requires local knowledge.

    In my market if I had to appraise a large house with an appropriate number of bedrooms I would just call this room a guest room or study or den and move on. I would also include the finished attic (as you described it) as part of the GLA and use ANSI procedures to calculate the floor area based on the slope and height of the ceiling area.
     
  9. CANative

    CANative Elite Member

    268
    Jun 18, 2003
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California
    Re-reading your post, it seems like this builder had an aversion to closets. How many rooms in the house have closets?

    Also, are you sure there are no closets just out side the guest room? I've seen a number of custom homes like that.
     
  10. Richard Carlsen

    Richard Carlsen Elite Member

    0
    Jan 15, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Licensed Appraiser
    State:
    Michigan
    That I don't understand.


    Greg posted

    Absolutely right. We have many chalets with open loft areas, walled on three sides and open to the front inside of the house which is open to the floor below. The market considers these as bedrooms. So do I when I do the bedroom count. More times than not, they are used as the main bedrooms. Most often, no bath or 1/2 bath on that level.
     
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