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Empty Pool

Discussion in 'Urgent - Help Needed' started by 23Degrees, Oct 1, 2011.

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  1. 23Degrees

    23Degrees Senior Member

    3
    Jan 31, 2004
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California
    This order originally came in with the footnote that the pool was empty and per the lender the home could be appraised without considering the pool as the pool was not going to be filled until after the loan cleared...:new_rofl:

    My response was that the report would be completed CB3 based on hypothetical that pool was filled and operational if the pool was in fact empty when I saw it.

    They have now indicated that they accept that I will proceed CB3 as the pool actually is going to be "removed" via concrete fill after the loan closing. So it will be CB3 based on HC that the pool has been removed and area filled in.

    I anticipate a 1004D request for this. My report will indicate that the 1004D will not be signed without evidence of proper demolition permits - I believe that this would be required in the city (LA) - but I'll be looking into it. If permits are not required (doubtful around here for an action of this sort) perhaps there are other things to consider as I don't really want to end up having to deal with any future complications if there are other considerations beyond just dumping concrete into a hole.

    Anything else I might need to consider (or views contrary to the above) on this from those that have dealt with it before or have similar experiences?
     
  2. residentialguy

    residentialguy Elite Member

    76
    Mar 24, 2009
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    Minnesota
    Give it a $50 water credit.
     
  3. residentialguy

    residentialguy Elite Member

    76
    Mar 24, 2009
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    Minnesota
    Better yet, since they don't want to consider the pool, you'll have to claim functional obsolesence....there's a big fricken hole in the back yard!
     
  4. VegasWayne

    VegasWayne Senior Member

    5
    Nov 15, 2007
    Professional Status:
    Licensed Appraiser
    State:
    Nevada
    Call it a skateboard park.
     
  5. 23Degrees

    23Degrees Senior Member

    3
    Jan 31, 2004
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California
    For anyone interested I'll close this one out with the latest info in case someone else runs into this type of issue - I found the regs related to pool backfills for LA. Pretty specific in terms of fill material, testing of fill material, grading specs and permits, drainage specs, compaction reports etc. An appraiser that signs off on or otherwise risks taking responsibility within the report for a bootlegged backfill could end up with an expensive problem.

    With no permit having yet been filed related to this issue for the subject it would not surprise me if a bootleg backfill was planned. It was interesting to see the morphing of the defined problem and proposed solutions put forward by the lender or their broker. I've indicated that a 1004D with the yes box checked will be impossible without proper documentation from the city. I wonder if they'll cancel and fish around for someone who'll sign off on option 1 (no value for the pool - he'll fill it when the loan closes) or option 2 (CB3 with 1004D when the hole in ground is gone regardless of whether or not it was done following city laws). No doubt they could find someone to go CB1 with cost to cure to fill a pool that apparently is not capable of holding water.
     
  6. Restrain

    Restrain Elite Member

    7
    Jan 22, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Certified General Appraiser
    State:
    Florida
    Your inspection would be that the pool was filled in. Period. You cannot verify the type of backfill, etc, since you were not there. A statement to that effect should be sufficient.
     
  7. Abester

    Abester Senior Member

    0
    Jun 12, 2003
    Professional Status:
    Certified General Appraiser
    State:
    Florida
    What a crock that the government now will not only require you follow rules to dig a hole, but also rules to fill in a hole. And people say we are better off with regulation. BS
     
  8. 23Degrees

    23Degrees Senior Member

    3
    Jan 31, 2004
    Professional Status:
    Certified Residential Appraiser
    State:
    California

    I disagree. There is a documented and regulated process for this type of demolition. If I play see no evil, hear no evil and check off the happy box on the 1004D just because I come back and the pool is gone I own that sucker. If it causes drainage problems for the neighbors, floats up, or the city gets wind and demands that it be re-done with permits I don't want my signature on it. No, the report will indicate that the demolition of the pool is a permitted process and I'll need to see the pool gone and the city inspector's signature on the final at which point the city will own it including verification of backfill material and everything else involved - then I'll sign the 1004D.

    In the case of the demolition option, CB2 with a permit filed to proceed and some level of contractor plan in place is the better option. By going CB3 it looks like I'm the one calling the pool faulty and requiring it to be removed. CB3 would be appropriate if the pool is obviously in disrepair or empty and the requirement is for it to be filled with water and functional. In this case they have now indicated that they are proceeding with a demolition so CB2 makes much more sense.

    Here is the link to backfill regs. Once the problem is out in the open like this and appraiser sign off is needed it would be best to just ask to see the paper indicating the city owns the final result.

    http://www.ci.la.ca.us/LADBS/faq/in...e/IB-P-BC 2002-111 Swimming Pool Backfill.pdf
     
  9. Abester

    Abester Senior Member

    0
    Jun 12, 2003
    Professional Status:
    Certified General Appraiser
    State:
    Florida
    It's no wonder California is in trouble.
     
  10. Terrel L. Shields

    Terrel L. Shields Elite Member
    Gold Supporting Member

    155
    May 2, 2002
    Professional Status:
    Certified General Appraiser
    State:
    Arkansas
    Why would it matter? I guess I miss the whole point. .. a pool is a pool and unless the equipment is missing, assume it can be filled ...
     
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