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  #1  
Old 03-06-2011, 08:44 AM
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Randall Garrett Randall Garrett is offline
 
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Default Outdoor screen technology

Starting a thread on a particular screen technology I have been following for a while. I typically do not specifically mention items which are not yet in production, or are not quite ready for prime time for appraisal use as I observe that this sort of thing can really be distracting. No use getting all worked up on stuff you cannot actually get or use… With the release of the Notion Ink Adam (albeit an early release and available in only very limited quantities), this technology goes from “lab” to “field” and I mentioned the device itself in the Motorola Xoom thread.

Motorola Xoom thread link: http://appraisersforum.com/showthread.php?t=176680

As usual, the thread has gotten somewhat off track from the Motorola Xoom itself, and now convers a much wider array of upcoming tab and related items. One of the most significant items (IMHO) of any you might consider for field use s outdoor view-ability. Sadly, most devices you will be bombarded with in the coming weeks have inferior (for our purposes) glossy screens. An anti-glare “matte” type screen helps some, but the real “culprit” here is the underlying technology – TFT type sisplays. Yes, the “magic” “IPS” technology helps in some scenarios as it offers wider viewing angles, allowing you to tilt the device to reflect the sun’s light away from your face, thus reducing some amount of glare. As well as this works, it is still a work-around. Those in less intensely sunny environments have a naturally higher acceptance of (say) an iPad’s screen, but a superior technology would benefit all, especially those who are daily exposed to sunny environments, or simply want better performance for field work.

There are a couple of upcoming technologies at play, but only one is in commercial production at this time – the Pixel Chi “3Qi” screen. The other interesting one is Mirasol, but that is still in the lab and bound first for 5.7” color e-readers first, if you believe the tech owner’s statements. There are variations of these two technologies that are announced, but they are all still “in the lab” and thus, I believe, a ways off before (and IF) we see devices sporting their stuff.

Anyway, one topic with respect to “tabs” is size and I mentioned that I know that production is ramping for a 7” device made possible by basically stuffing a 7” 3Qi screen into an updated 7” regular LCD-sporting Android e-Reader. This makes for an interesting possibility for those who find a 10.1” (like the Adam, the Motorola Xoom, and other emerging competitors) too big, or even the iPad’s 9.7” screen… As can be read on the linked forum and other places, I find the 7” form factor to offer some real advantages. YMMV on this, and as usual I have no dog in this hunt, so I post this for informative purposes only – no agenda, as usual, other than to educate in hopes it gives you more to work with when making a decision this Spring (the optimum time IMHO.)

Upcoming 7” 3Qi screen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZiVejG_t2A

I will scour my resources and add more links and info if this is a topic people want to know more about.

BTW, the Pixel Qi thing is not a “brand” of screen, it is a technology which improves on existing LCD screens. Pixel Qi does not make screens, they license their technology to people who make screens. That said, they have (finally) publicly announced a partnership with a major fab to increase production as demand is strong in the enterprise arena. This is because of the battery savings and superior performance and a significantly lower cost than the “indoor-outdoor” screen of yesteryear. The major reason why deploying a 3Qi screen over a regular LCD is the relatively low production rate, not the licensing fee. That is, most consumers (seem to) want the glossy screens for indoor video, surfing and Facebook type activities…


-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/
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Old 03-06-2011, 08:49 AM
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I'd like a little more detail.
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  #3  
Old 03-06-2011, 10:19 AM
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TC,

Ask and ye shall recieve... ;-)

ZTE Light 2
Spot by JKK at MWC in Barcelona last month on the ZTE Light 2 - a 7 inch "pain vanilla" Android e-Reader which is announced to come with the Pixel Qi screen seen in the earlier link. Note the size compared to the Galaxy Tab. Taking my earlier comments about portability into account, the smaller overall dimensions (and lighter weight - way under 1 lb), I find this to be a compelling combination. I already run a wide variety of software successfully on both my GalTab and Nook Color. The difference here is that I observe this device to be between the GalTab and Nook in thickness and smaller overall in your hand with no decrease in screen size vs. the GalTab or NC. The video was not shot by me - I saw this device only after getting a near real-time feed from JKK while at MWC, but on the very device JKK was showing, I found that the processor handled video adequately for my video needs (i.e. YouTube and typical web stuff) but is not geared for the real video enthusiast (1080p output, etc.) Was unable to load my own software on that device, but knowing the specs, I am confident it will handle it easily! ZTE is a major supplier to the public in China, not a lightweight fly-by-night operation. I know of two North American distributor types in a bidding war for US exclusivity ATM. We'll see who gets it, but I'd get this one "gray market" if I had to, even pay Dynamism's $50 premium (?) for convenience. This one will likely be at or below the price of the Nook Color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cv22qYg3wbE


3Qi vs. e-Ink vs. TransFlective
Here is a link to an early engineering sample of the 3Qi screen stuffed into a garden variety Acer netbook, next to a Kindle e-Reader and a high dollar Toshiba notebook with a true TransFlective screen. TransFlective screens were common in the later PPC days - i.e. my faves HP hx4700/4705 and Dell Axim 51v - but are extremely rare at this size. They are very expensive but many find them superior in overall performance to the more common "indoor/outdoor" screens found in the Motion, Lenovo, Fujitsu, etc. Tablet PC's of yesteryear. This video was shot only a few days before I met with these folks in SA at a conference, where I was BLOWN AWAY by the performance of their tech. The earlier video on the 7" screen was shot under bright lights (most booths shy away from this because it trashes their screens) but nothing is as telling as real sunlight. The cheap video cameras we commonly use react poorly to quickly changing light conditions, so the "blooming" you saw in the earlier video was due to the recording device, NOT the 3Qi screen. This video is a little geeky, but one of the best for folks who want an idea of what this screen is really like, short of personal exposure. From what I have seen myself in the interim between when this one was shot and today, the overall screen quality, including viewing angles and color depth has improved somewhat. Still, I think even the average Joe can clearly see how superior this screen tech is for our outdoor purposes while not overly compromising indoor use.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oawX3wenxNc


3Qi vs. iPad
Finally, just to put it into direct viewing comparison, here is a video of a "mid-life" 3Qi screen next to an iPad. The distinction is obvious... Once you actually see this, it is hard not to shake your head when "pundits" rant on how great the iPad screen is outdoors. This is truly a case of ignorance on their part, and not intended as a slam on the iPad. The iPad was never designed for outdoor use. For what it was intended for, I find it to be a great device, but I know better is possible. Same complaint applies to the iPad competitors - I am an equal opportunity basher ;-) Actually, I just want what I want. I know it is possible, and I want it. It is frustrating to have to hunt this stuff down, but rewarding when you finally get it. I'd love to have the upcoming 9.7" 3Qi screen in (say) and iPad 3, but with their focus, the chances of that are between slim and none IMHO, so we'll just have to see who produces what with the upcoming screens and, again, I am not at liberty to say who has told me they are. Even if it was, I would be reluctant to say until I can walk into Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Verizon, or wherever and actually purchase one. I refused to even mention the Xoom until I did just that. Again, not much to gain by ranting over something you cannot actually have... ;-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NotK4TVQ-6E



Hope this helps!

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..
(Thankfully now at a real computer keyboard, LOL)

/end/
  #4  
Old 03-06-2011, 10:36 AM
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Calvin the Airedale Calvin the Airedale is offline
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I'll be buying an iPad2 soon and intend to use it mostly indoors and as much for checking emails and reading web content as working with DaVinci.

I don't do any mobile computing right now and in fact just bought my first Disto.

I love my iPhone. (In fact, googling "symptoms of a heart attack" this past Christmas on my iPhone may have saved my life!) But I have trouble with screen size.

The 3Qi devices you're talking about appear interesting. And I'm sure they view better outdoors. But really, how tough is it for someone who has no experiential reference in mobile computing to adjust their use behaviors to deal with this problem?
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  #5  
Old 03-07-2011, 12:18 PM
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CtA,

Great, if the iPad works for you and your environment, go for it! :-) It seems, though, that you have already decided on the iPad 2 without even being able to try it (since it is not even out yet.) I am sure I will replace one of my own iPad's with an iPad 2, but I think folks should also check out other devices and see which one(s) works better for them. I think you are a little off track with respect to whether you employ mobile computing, however. You mention the iPhone and DaVinci, which in my mind means you are using (or plan to) do "mobile computing." You Googled "heart attack" and to me, whether you were sitting at your desk or out in the field, you were still using mobile technology and "computing"... Glad things worked out for you in that respect and I am sure your example helps remind us all how having ready access to usable technology is both convenient and important. Thanks for sharing!

My intent with sharing what I know of certain technologies is to help folks make more informed decisions, and for ME the ability to SEE the screen (and thus interact with it) is a major factor. Your final statement thus leaves me a bit puzzled as you indicate that the iPhone screen is too small for you to comfortably use, and I see that as very closely related to the view-ability properties of outdoor screens. If the iPhone screen is too small for you to see or interact with comfortably, why cannot you just adjust your own "use behaviors to deal with" the problem? The iPhone 4 certainly has adequate screen resolution, so that should not be the problem. Just hold it closer, or employ a capacitive stylus if your fingers are too big. I say this not as a challenge, nor to illicit debate here, but just to offer some perspective on items that others seem to find important. Some folks work in different environments than you, and to them, a better screen is important... :-) Maybe if someone had offered you more insightful info on your own recent DISTO purchase, you might have gotten a D5 instead of a D8, thus saving you some money... :-)

This thread was started to share information about outdoor screen tech which others may not yet be aware of, and I did not envision it being a pro- or con- forum on Apple (or Motorola, or HTC, or Samsung) products. I own and personally use several Apple products - iMac, iPhone and iPads - and try to stay out of the debate on whether Apple is great or "evil", LOL. Perhaps you read something I did not intend into my mentioning/linking to a video the comparing the iPad screen? If so, please know that the intent was to show the difference between the technologies deployed, not to bash the iPad. The iPad, for better or for worse, is (deservedly IMHO) the standard by which other devices of this type are measured, so it is only natural that the person shooting the video (not me) used it in comparison. With regard to screens and outdoor view-ability, the Motorola Xoom and others competing in the tab space have the same problem. Hopefully, we can move on and void getting this thread off topic and stick to providing information for those who are interested in this aspect of mobile technology... :-)

Thanks!

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/
  #6  
Old 03-07-2011, 12:35 PM
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Calvin the Airedale Calvin the Airedale is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall Garrett View Post
CtA,

Great, if the iPad works for you and your environment, go for it! :-) It seems, though, that you have already decided on the iPad 2 without even being able to try it (since it is not even out yet.) I am sure I will replace one of my own iPad's with an iPad 2, but I think folks should also check out other devices and see which one(s) works better for them. I think you are a little off track with respect to whether you employ mobile computing, however. You mention the iPhone and DaVinci, which in my mind means you are using (or plan to) do "mobile computing." You Googled "heart attack" and to me, whether you were sitting at your desk or out in the field, you were still using mobile technology and "computing"... Glad things worked out for you in that respect and I am sure your example helps remind us all how having ready access to usable technology is both convenient and important. Thanks for sharing!

My intent with sharing what I know of certain technologies is to help folks make more informed decisions, and for ME the ability to SEE the screen (and thus interact with it) is a major factor. Your final statement thus leaves me a bit puzzled as you indicate that the iPhone screen is too small for you to comfortably use, and I see that as very closely related to the view-ability properties of outdoor screens. If the iPhone screen is too small for you to see or interact with comfortably, why cannot you just adjust your own "use behaviors to deal with" the problem? The iPhone 4 certainly has adequate screen resolution, so that should not be the problem. Just hold it closer, or employ a capacitive stylus if your fingers are too big. I say this not as a challenge, nor to illicit debate here, but just to offer some perspective on items that others seem to find important. Some folks work in different environments than you, and to them, a better screen is important... :-) Maybe if someone had offered you more insightful info on your own recent DISTO purchase, you might have gotten a D5 instead of a D8, thus saving you some money... :-)

This thread was started to share information about outdoor screen tech which others may not yet be aware of, and I did not envision it being a pro- or con- forum on Apple (or Motorola, or HTC, or Samsung) products. I own and personally use several Apple products - iMac, iPhone and iPads - and try to stay out of the debate on whether Apple is great or "evil", LOL. Perhaps you read something I did not intend into my mentioning/linking to a video the comparing the iPad screen? If so, please know that the intent was to show the difference between the technologies deployed, not to bash the iPad. The iPad, for better or for worse, is (deservedly IMHO) the standard by which other devices of this type are measured, so it is only natural that the person shooting the video (not me) used it in comparison. With regard to screens and outdoor view-ability, the Motorola Xoom and others competing in the tab space have the same problem. Hopefully, we can move on and void getting this thread off topic and stick to providing information for those who are interested in this aspect of mobile technology... :-)

Thanks!

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/
Thank you Randall, I really wasn't trying to be cute when I asked how difficult it is to adjust one's behaviors for outdoor screen views. I asked because I've never had to do it.

My purchase of the iPad is less motivated by my potential business uses than by how I think it will improve my personal uses (including hanging out on this forum) in contrast to how that experience happens on my iPhone.

Also, I bought the D8 as a means of keeping my options open in case I should decide to later buy something more muscular than an iPad that can run for instance Apex, which I thought, can use the blue tooth connectivity of the D8 on almost anything except an iPad.
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  #7  
Old 03-07-2011, 01:21 PM
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CtA,

Great! We're all on the same page. No harm, no foul! :-) Let's move on with the discussion(s.)
BTW, LOL @ slogan...

-Randall-
  #8  
Old 03-07-2011, 01:33 PM
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CtA,

Great! We're all on the same page. No harm, no foul! :-) Let's move on with the discussion(s.)
BTW, LOL @ slogan...

-Randall-
I'm sure your mother, like mine, gave you similar advice.

I do not own a lap top but would definitely give it serious consideration if the choice did not seem so daunting. Not just for what it might potentially run, but for cost and convenience.

You can see, I hope, how from my perspective how the consideration of a device based on its outdoor view-ability only makes that decision harder to make.
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Old 03-09-2011, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall Garrett View Post
Starting a thread on a particular screen technology I have been following for a while. I typically do not specifically mention items which are not yet in production, or are not quite ready for prime time for appraisal use as I observe that this sort of thing can really be distracting. No use getting all worked up on stuff you cannot actually get or use… With the release of the Notion Ink Adam (albeit an early release and available in only very limited quantities), this technology goes from “lab” to “field” and I mentioned the device itself in the Motorola Xoom thread.

Motorola Xoom thread link: http://appraisersforum.com/showthread.php?t=176680

As usual, the thread has gotten somewhat off track from the Motorola Xoom itself, and now convers a much wider array of upcoming tab and related items. One of the most significant items (IMHO) of any you might consider for field use s outdoor view-ability. Sadly, most devices you will be bombarded with in the coming weeks have inferior (for our purposes) glossy screens. An anti-glare “matte” type screen helps some, but the real “culprit” here is the underlying technology – TFT type sisplays. Yes, the “magic” “IPS” technology helps in some scenarios as it offers wider viewing angles, allowing you to tilt the device to reflect the sun’s light away from your face, thus reducing some amount of glare. As well as this works, it is still a work-around. Those in less intensely sunny environments have a naturally higher acceptance of (say) an iPad’s screen, but a superior technology would benefit all, especially those who are daily exposed to sunny environments, or simply want better performance for field work.

There are a couple of upcoming technologies at play, but only one is in commercial production at this time – the Pixel Chi “3Qi” screen. The other interesting one is Mirasol, but that is still in the lab and bound first for 5.7” color e-readers first, if you believe the tech owner’s statements. There are variations of these two technologies that are announced, but they are all still “in the lab” and thus, I believe, a ways off before (and IF) we see devices sporting their stuff.

Anyway, one topic with respect to “tabs” is size and I mentioned that I know that production is ramping for a 7” device made possible by basically stuffing a 7” 3Qi screen into an updated 7” regular LCD-sporting Android e-Reader. This makes for an interesting possibility for those who find a 10.1” (like the Adam, the Motorola Xoom, and other emerging competitors) too big, or even the iPad’s 9.7” screen… As can be read on the linked forum and other places, I find the 7” form factor to offer some real advantages. YMMV on this, and as usual I have no dog in this hunt, so I post this for informative purposes only – no agenda, as usual, other than to educate in hopes it gives you more to work with when making a decision this Spring (the optimum time IMHO.)

Upcoming 7” 3Qi screen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZiVejG_t2A

I will scour my resources and add more links and info if this is a topic people want to know more about.

BTW, the Pixel Qi thing is not a “brand” of screen, it is a technology which improves on existing LCD screens. Pixel Qi does not make screens, they license their technology to people who make screens. That said, they have (finally) publicly announced a partnership with a major fab to increase production as demand is strong in the enterprise arena. This is because of the battery savings and superior performance and a significantly lower cost than the “indoor-outdoor” screen of yesteryear. The major reason why deploying a 3Qi screen over a regular LCD is the relatively low production rate, not the licensing fee. That is, most consumers (seem to) want the glossy screens for indoor video, surfing and Facebook type activities…


-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/
Hi Randall, I would be interested in any other information regarding the Pixel Qi screens, so let me encourage you to keep digging. Thank you for what you have posted already.
  #10  
Old 03-09-2011, 08:47 PM
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CtA,

Good advice, but I am not going to give my mother any additional ammo by publicly admitting to her wisdom. LOL She already has enough dirt on me now... ;-)

HOPEfully, some of this new tech will boil down and "stabilize" to where the choices for you will be less daunting in the following weeks. I still predict that by "Spring" (early summer for some) most all significant items will be known and familiar enough for folks to make a wise decision that will be productive for them for a decent period of time without so much fear that "the magic device" is just about to be released... ;-) If it really is/was magic, it will still be magic 2 or three months from now, but maybe less expensive ;-) This is not new...

If you are TRULY on the fence, and just need MORE items to make your head spin, look at the Asus Transformer (if you can do a Google/Android laptop) or for the truly adventurous, wait for the US version of the Lenovo LePad. I was able to touch and peck on one when it was the U1 Hybrid at CES 2010, and welcomed the change/improvement at CES 2011 when it became the LePad (wimp name, IMHO). I like the improvements so far, but always hope for more (can you say Pixel Qi? LOL) The feel is much better and I am glad they are holding it from US release until Honeycomb is aboard. I can wish for Sandy Bridge for the battery life and overall performance boost. It does feel closer to 3.5 lbs than 4 to me, but the removable portion is less than the iPad 1 or MotoXoom, just for reference. I like the Win7 on laptop and Android when undocked. It was smoother to operate the re-dock than I have seen on various videos, but I also know that Lenovo desires to improve it prior to US (picky) users, so I am content to wait until June for this one. It will not likely satisfy a pure notebook user, but for casual or "in car" work, what could be better than to be running your full suite of Windows apps in the car (parked of course, LOL), then sliding the "screen" (tablet) out to do the mobile portions. I don't normally post on "far out" stuff, but I have seen this two times running and Lenovo is already official in a ship date for home (China) and almost solid for June in the US. Lenovo is not like the clone guys, announcing and pulling products. This one seems solid to me. Normal caveats apply. Quick video link, other all over the web. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVc2uZ2XQCA


339W,

Happy to help. I will return this thread to outdoor screen-oriented posts and start another one for "tabs", etc. I happen to know more about some upcoming 3Qi devices, but again, I cannot comment at this time. I did, however find a rogue video where MLJ let something slip. If you know what she is talking about, it is a slip. In any case, if you follow mobile devices, it is not hard to connect the dots at an approx 87.4% level of accuracy... ;-) That number is pure fiction - just searching for some humor. I will post the video link in the one to follow this. The next one is sort of back-tracking to older Lenovo screens, for reference and to point out an item or two.

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/

Last edited by Randall Garrett : 03-09-2011 at 09:16 PM. Reason: typos...
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