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  #1  
Old 09-27-2011, 08:59 AM
Howard Bouchard Howard Bouchard is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Spokane
State: Washington
Professional Status: Certified Residential Appraiser
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Question Revision

Revision request:

""- Appraiser states the original home had a laundry area with a toilet area which has been turned into a full bath. Per appraiser this is done without permits. Appraiser to give value only as the original structure "laundry area and toilet area (.25 bath) and provide a cost to cure to turn it back into the original state. **No value given for the full bath.

- Appraiser to comment if the enclosed patio area was done with permits & provide permit number. If not done with permits appraiser to give it no value, comment on it's worksmanship, does it conform to the homes sturcture, and provide a cost to cure to remove the enclosure. ""

I am not sure what to make of this as I have never had anyone ask for something like this. It should be noted that the effective date of this appraisal was prior to Sept 1 by a month or so. It should be noted that the bath was noted as a recent remodeling project in the appraisal and that the appraiser was asked to make assurances that permits were acquired for said project at the time the appraisal was first submitted. No permits were found online and the homeowner as much as said she did not pull permits so I wasn't about to make assurances they shw did.

Going forward can we regularily expect this sort of thing with the new Condition requirements regarding the updating and remodeling of kitchens and baths on the new 2055 and 1004 forms? What would you do with this?
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  #2  
Old 09-27-2011, 09:29 AM
Don Clark's Avatar
Don Clark Don Clark is offline
 
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Location: Virginia Beach, Virginia
State: Virginia
Professional Status: Certified Residential Appraiser
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Bouchard View Post
Revision request:

""- Appraiser states the original home had a laundry area with a toilet area which has been turned into a full bath. Per appraiser this is done without permits. Appraiser to give value only as the original structure "laundry area and toilet area (.25 bath) and provide a cost to cure to turn it back into the original state. **No value given for the full bath.

- Appraiser to comment if the enclosed patio area was done with permits & provide permit number. If not done with permits appraiser to give it no value, comment on it's worksmanship, does it conform to the homes sturcture, and provide a cost to cure to remove the enclosure. ""

I am not sure what to make of this as I have never had anyone ask for something like this. It should be noted that the effective date of this appraisal was prior to Sept 1 by a month or so. It should be noted that the bath was noted as a recent remodeling project in the appraisal and that the appraiser was asked to make assurances that permits were acquired for said project at the time the appraisal was first submitted. No permits were found online and the homeowner as much as said she did not pull permits so I wasn't about to make assurances they shw did.

Going forward can we regularily expect this sort of thing with the new Condition requirements regarding the updating and remodeling of kitchens and baths on the new 2055 and 1004 forms? What would you do with this?
Unless it was part of the original scope of work, this is a new assignment.
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  #3  
Old 09-27-2011, 09:50 AM
Howard Bouchard Howard Bouchard is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Spokane
State: Washington
Professional Status: Certified Residential Appraiser
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That was my thinking. Perhaps we should just complete fully self-contained reports going forward, thereby avoid these sorts of requests. This seems to be indicative of the direction we are headed; as well as being asked to make assurances beyond the scope of our license and expertise.
  #4  
Old 09-27-2011, 02:18 PM
Don Clark's Avatar
Don Clark Don Clark is offline
 
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State: Virginia
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Originally Posted by Howard Bouchard View Post
That was my thinking. Perhaps we should just complete fully self-contained reports going forward, thereby avoid these sorts of requests. This seems to be indicative of the direction we are headed; as well as being asked to make assurances beyond the scope of our license and expertise.
I have been doing this for many years and I have never seen a true self contained appraisal report, residential or commercial.
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  #5  
Old 09-27-2011, 04:35 PM
NorthTexValuation NorthTexValuation is offline
 
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State: Texas
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They are asking you to revise your report in a way that will be misleading, pure and simple. The fact that you cannot state that permits were obtained does not equate with the remodeled features having no contributory value.

And btw, please identify this client so we can steer clear of them. Thank you.
  #6  
Old 09-27-2011, 10:17 PM
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Terrel L. Shields Terrel L. Shields is online now
 
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Quote:
The fact that you cannot state that permits were obtained does not equate with the remodeled features having no contributory value.
Amen Brother Tex
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  #7  
Old 09-28-2011, 11:51 AM
Walter Kirk Walter Kirk is offline
 
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Location: Audubon, N.J.
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They are telling you how to do your job. If you consider yourself a mere form filler go ahead and give them what they want. If you consider yourself a professional tell them to pound sand.
  #8  
Old 09-29-2011, 06:31 PM
Howard Bouchard Howard Bouchard is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Spokane
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""Hi Howard, nice to talk with you today. Per lender request - due to no permits for the second bathroom, no value can be give to the second bathroom. Please revise report to one bathroom on the grid and make any adjustment for the bathrooms. On the enclosed patio there are no permits, the lender is requesting no value be given to it. Please remove any value on the grid given to the enclosed patio. Please review your opinion of value and adjust if needed. Thank you for all your help with this.""

As you can see I have not proceeded with this and had told them that their request was actually for a new appraisal assignment. However above is today's new twist. I was assured this was done all the time regarding unpermitted areas. I requested the above in writing so I could see if what they were talking about on the phone was any different from the first request. All my comps have 6/3/2 room count, so to my thinking if I remove the bath in grid I will have a hypo and would need to consider new comps (new appraisal) beginning with the new 6/3/1 count. Then there is the patio ... . I am inclined to decline unless I can be convinced here that any of this now makes good sense- oh well there goes another one. What is your thinking now?
  #9  
Old 09-29-2011, 06:42 PM
NorthTexValuation NorthTexValuation is offline
 
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State: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Bouchard View Post
""Hi Howard, nice to talk with you today. Per lender request - due to no permits for the second bathroom, no value can be give to the second bathroom. Please revise report to one bathroom on the grid and make any adjustment for the bathrooms. On the enclosed patio there are no permits, the lender is requesting no value be given to it. Please remove any value on the grid given to the enclosed patio. Please review your opinion of value and adjust if needed. Thank you for all your help with this.""...

I was assured this was done all the time regarding unpermitted areas.

What is your thinking now?
Just because the lender requests this be "done all the time" and some appraisers evidently complying (while most likely violating USPAP in the process) does not make it the correct thing to do.

If its my report, they get no revision, period.

If they don't like that, order a new appraisal from somebody else.
  #10  
Old 09-29-2011, 06:44 PM
NorthTexValuation NorthTexValuation is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
State: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Kirk View Post
They are telling you how to do your job. If you consider yourself a mere form filler go ahead and give them what they want. If you consider yourself a professional tell them to pound sand.
I wish I had bothered to read this before adding my latest 2 cents, perfect answer!
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