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Appraisers Benefiting From Real Estate Investors

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Arnell Esseryn

Freshman Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2003
I am a real estate investor who buys and resells houses quickly. I generally, buy slightly below retail and then resell at or slightly above retail.

MLS expired listing would be a great source of leads for my real estate investing business. In addition, it would be tremendously valuable to have MLS data to run comps instead of relying strictly on the tax records. The problem is gaining access to them. You need a real estate agents license or be a licensed appraiser to gain MLS data access in my county.

This is my ideal to gain MLS access and offer appraisers the opportunity profit. Write a postcard or letter to all appraisers in my county and offer the following:

1. A $500 referral fee (to be paid if the deal closes) for the contact info of any homeowner / seller that does not actually close their sell. The appraiser will be able to submit their info via a website. The referral fee would be paid by me at form my closing proceeds. I figure that this should be fast easy money for appraisers since all they have to do is give me a name and phone number.

2. Cooperative advertising opportunity. Next month I plan on blanket mailing 5.66" x 11" postcards to neighborhoods I would like to buy in. These postcards are what are called a jumbo postcards and have plenty of space for the ad copy. Half of one side of the postcard will be allocated to the appraiser for them to place their ad copy. This is about a 5.5" x 5.66" space. Next, at my expense I will printed have mailed about 1000 to 1500 postcards to my target neighborhood. Basically this would be no cost advertising for appraisers.

In exchange, for this I would like unlimited access to the MLS data.

Would this be a good idea?
 
W

walt kirk

Guest
It seems to me that you are asking appraisers to violate the rules of the local MLS. May I suggest that you hire an appraiser as a consultant to provide you with information on expired listings in the areas in which you are interested.
 

Arnell Esseryn

Freshman Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2003
Originally posted by walt kirk@Apr 2 2003, 04:24 PM
It seems to me that you are asking appraisers to violate the rules of the local MLS. May I suggest that you hire an appraiser as a consultant to provide you with information on expired listings in the areas in which you are interested.
I was not a where that it was possible to hire an appriaser as a consultant. What is the typical arrangement or fees, if any, would be appropriate? Can this be setup as a "as needed basis" instead of a ongoing consulting basis? Perhaps I could trade the postcard mailings for the MLS listings?

In any event, there was a reason why I wanted unlimted access to the MLS. This arrangement would make it as hassle free for both the appraiser and myself.

What you wrote gives my a another ideal. I assume that an appraiser can provided others with access to the MLS data for legitimate business purposes....right? For example, an unlincesed assistant or marketing partner of an appraiser might need access to the MLS data to preform their duties.

Figure out what the local MLS rules are about sharing data and find a work around that does not violate those rules yet gives the appraiser and myself what we both want.

In this case, form some sort of legitimate relationship with a appraiser where it could be justified, within the context of the local MLS guidlines, for me to have unlimited access.

What do you all think?
 

Jeff Horton

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Alabama
Originally posted by Arnell Esseryn@Apr 2 2003, 04:20 PM

In this case, form some sort of legitimate relationship with a appraiser where it could be justified, within the context of the local MLS guidlines, for me to have unlimited access.
I wasn't going to comment on this but it just keeps bugging me.

What I read is that you don't have a right to access the data and you are just trying to find someone that will let you use it. From what you said about the MLS rules you have no right to the data period.

Maybe there is a way to "technical" get around the rules but would it be ethical? If you truly worked as assistant to an appraiser you might have a right to access it. But not unlimted access and especially not for the purposes you are wanting. Face it, what you are asking for someone to break the rules to benefit you and any way you slice it is that is wrong.
 

xmrdfghap

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
General Public
State
Florida
I don't understand why you don't hire a buyers agent? Set up a flat fee per property and have him keep on top of things.

Or, just for fun, go get your real estate license. Then you can play with MLS all day long.....and who knows, you might even sell a property or two that you don't own.
 

Mountain Man

Elite Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Georgia
I gotta agree with Greg. Find an agent that wants to work with you. Or, it's so easy to get a RE sales license, go for it.... in 3 months you too can claim part of the sales commission.

Appraisers are generally considered to be "affiliate" members of MLS. IE: we may not have full access to all the MLS data, and are bound by very strict rules regarding disclosure to non-clients.
 

Arnell Esseryn

Freshman Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2003
Originally posted by Jeff Horton+Apr 2 2003, 10:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Jeff Horton @ Apr 2 2003, 10:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--Arnell Esseryn@Apr 2 2003, 04:20 PM

In this case, form some sort of legitimate relationship with a appraiser where it could be justified, within the context of the local MLS guidlines, for me to have unlimited access.
I wasn't going to comment on this but it just keeps bugging me.

What I read is that you don't have a right to access the data and you are just trying to find someone that will let you use it. From what you said about the MLS rules you have no right to the data period.

Maybe there is a way to "technical" get around the rules but would it be ethical? If you truly worked as assistant to an appraiser you might have a right to access it. But not unlimted access and especially not for the purposes you are wanting. Face it, what you are asking for someone to break the rules to benefit you and any way you slice it is that is wrong.[/b][/quote]
I do not know the full extent of the rules regarding MLS access. If the rules say "you can not have MLS access with the exceptions of.....", then I do not see the ethical dilemma if I can fall into one of those exceptions.

I used an "appraiser’s assistant" as an example, to illustrate the point there are already implied exceptions to the MLS data access exclusions.. Not that I necessarily would want to become one. However, if I did and I genuinely preformed the duties of an appraiser’s assistant; then are you implying that it is inherently unethical because my intentions was to gain MLS access? If so then you and I have to agree to disagree.

Finally, I think you misinterpreted my intentions. I am not nor will I ever ask any appraiser "break the rules to benefit you" as you put. If you reread my post then you will see I am trying to offer something of value to the appraiser in exchange for the MLS access. I am taking a "what is in it for them [appraisers]" approach. I am not asking something for nothing. I am offering not cost direct mail adverting to residential households and referral fees. In addition, in my second response, I emphasize finding a way to work within the rules. In other words, if the rules permit exceptions that will allow what I want then why not use them?

Let me ask you this. Are appraisers obligated to only accept cash in exchange for their services? What if a auto mechanic needed a appraisal and a appraiser needed some major transmission work done on their vehicle. Both services happen to cost $300. Could the mechanic and the appraiser trade services instead on money? Mostly likely so!

Let us not become fixated on "unlimited access". Although I would prefer it, monthly MLS access would be fine. I intend to mail postcards to 1000-2000 households each month whether or not I can find a appraiser to work with me. I purpose trading an appraise
 

Arnell Esseryn

Freshman Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2003
Originally posted by Greg Goodpasture@Apr 2 2003, 10:14 PM
I don't understand why you don't hire a buyers agent? Set up a flat fee per property and have him keep on top of things.

Or, just for fun, go get your real estate license. Then you can play with MLS all day long.....and who knows, you might even sell a property or two that you don't own.
I did have a buyers agent a few years ago. He even made me sign an exclusive listing agreement. It did not work out. The irony was not only did he not do what I wanted of him, but ended up doing making more work for himself. He pretty much soured me on using agents. However, I have been told having an agent that works with you is an invaluable tool for the real estate investor, so working with an agent again is definitely a possibility. But finding a good one to work with is like panning for gold. If you work hard enough you will eventually find the golden nugget, but you will have to sling through allot of mud first.

There is a back and forth debate, in the real estate investor community, about the virtues of a investor having a real estate license or not. Both sides have merit. However, after hearing both sides of the argument, I personally believe that it is best not to have a license and instead work with someone who does. IMHO, by working with someone with a lice
 

Peggy Wright

Sophomore Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2003
I am a real estate appraiser who is also an investor. I buy houses well below market rehab them and sell them at market or just slightly above.

What you are not aware of is that there are guidelines in the MLS about service access. If you don't pay for the access, you don't have a right to use it. Kind of like software. If you don't buy it, do you have a right to use it?

What you might consider, is contact an appraiser or agent in your local REI group and ask them to run comps for you at a fee. An agent in our group will run comps at $10.00/comp. Now, ifyou are just starting out and that is too pricey, maybe you could do something like fill their flier boxes or something in trade. The key is, they are pulling the comps with their access, not giving you free access.
 

Carnivore

Elite Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
North Carolina
OK, I can't resist commenting. Everyone has given you great answers and or solutions. I have been around here long enough to get away with the next paragraph.

If I understand Sir, you want unlimited access to copyrighted information for a fee, but most likely for free if the deal does not close(what ever that means). You did offer a carrot in advertising(as if we need any help). You apparently are unwilling to spend any of your own money or invest any of your own time to become a Realtor(registered trademark) or an appraiser to be able to join a local MLS. Most likely because you apparently dont like the rules most MLS systems have and are looking for away around them. Given that if you joined and they found out you were abusing the system you most likely would have your membership terminated. You know or have a perception that appraisers are easily corruptable.

Your looking for answers in the wrong place. The appraisers that frequent this site are honest, ethical and highly professional. We dont like ponzi schemes, low life predatory lenders and investors, pushy AMC's and AVM companies. May I suggest you enlist the aid of a mortgage broker.

http://www.mortgagemag.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ult...gi?action=intro

Hope we all have been of some help. The crowd at the mortgage forum probably think and have a lot in common with you.
 
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