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Do I Need A Supervisor For Most Appraisals?

ltyrni

Thread Starter
Freshman Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2018
Professional Status
Appraiser Trainee
State
Iowa
THE BACKGROUND:

I am an "associate" appraiser. I have demonstrated competency in my area and types of property. I have four appraisals waiting on my supervisor to sign. These are my clients. I went to the banks, I got the work. We both went on inspection on two of them and I went with him on his that day. I did all data collection, analysis, reconciliation, narrative, everything. It is in his email inbox. I have called. I have texted. I have emailed. I have stopped by his house (not there). I have everything. Just get put off or ignored. These are two agriculture appraisals and two residential. There are $3,400 in fees from all four together and he gets half. They are complete. There is nothing from his side but review, which is minimal, and signature. I have another ag appraisal on schedule for next week. I get all my own work and do nothing to burden my supervisor. He gets a question here and there and is informed of every appraisal I receive and I use his filing system so he gets his share for taking me on.

This is really bothering me though! I have a good reputation and I am building good rapport with my clients, and it really frustrates me to have that goodwill be dependent on someone else doing their minor part of which they get half the reward for..... I am in a rural area. There are almost no appraisers within 60 air miles. The state told me to try to pickup another supervisor at distance. That sounds simple, but good luck convincing someone to take you on outside of your area with a "trust me". But I will do it if need be and start calling down the state list with the offers of partnership until I find someone.... Digress.

THE QUESTION:

I was reading this:

http://appraisalinstitutedc.org/pdf/AI-FederallyRelatedTransactions.pdf

What is a federally related transaction? I thought it pretty much meant any bank with FDIC coverage which is all of them to my knowledge. Well, I guess not....

So can I really just do most appraisals without a supervisor? If the banks actually hire me and I can get the work, can I just do that? Could I still count those appraisal hours toward my certification?

SPECIFICS:

The ones on his desk are a $65,000 home, a $336,000 home, a $344,000 farm, and a $1,360,000 farm with significant improvements. The first home definitely. The second home secures a small home equity LoC, under $100,000, so that one I could too right?

The first farm is a high LTV, co-signed by the well-heeled farmer parent of the buyer. The transaction value is a business transaction under the $1,000,000 threshold, but it does require the production income to pay for the note. Is that different than this line:

"(ii) Is not dependent on the sale of, or rental income derived from, real estate as the primary source of repayment"

Same goes for the second farm, the actual transaction value is under $1,000,000; the loan amount on refinance is $550,000. It depends on the producer's income from cultivating the land himself. That's not rental income right?

ALSO, both farms are secured with a lien on real estate, which was exempt item 2 on AI's list. So since they are both secured by a lien as an abundance of caution, can I just do them myself and count the hours towards my own certification?

I called ASFMRA to seek their advice and help on the issue and see if they could help me on the direction, but someone was out of the office or didn't care to help me. Same with my call to the Appraisal Foundation looking for guidance. Should have called the Appraisal Institute I guess and will Monday.

FOR REITERATION:

Do I need a supervisor if 90% of transactions aren't federally related as AI states and I can get the banks to use me anyway? Can I count my hours as well so I can get my actual "certification" and not have to worry about it?

Thanks for reading my jeremiad and for any helpful advice! Hope all have a great weekend!
 

Terrel L. Shields

Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
May 2, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Arkansas
If the bank is "OK" with it, you don't need his signature on the smaller reports and don't waste time waiting on such a jerk. Find a new super if you can.
Once the final rules are approved the de minimus will be $400,000 I believe, so check your appraisal regulations. Here, there are set limits BY THE STATE that are more stringent that that the Feds require. So regardless the loan amount, our state has a limitation of $250,000 for most non-certified transactions.
 

Michigan CG

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Michigan
.............There are $3,400 in fees from all four together and he gets half. They are complete. There is nothing from his side but review, which is minimal, and signature.........
You are getting 50% as a trainee and you will make $1,700 this week. And you are complaining?

There is nothing from his side? Let me see. He taught you how to appraise ag properties. He reviews and that little signature is required and he earned, you didn't.

He taught you the right educators to find (ASFMRA and AI) and not Bob's skool of dog grooming and Appraisal.

Most trainees make far less percentage than you and have to work a lot harder to make $1,700. $1,700 is eleven residential reports for a lot of trainees.

I doubt you can write your own reports and sign them by yourself without him. His signature means a whole lot. I have an Iowa license and that thought never occurred to me.

Many ag appraisal assignments require a CG license.

I suggest you be happy for what you have and find a way to solve the problem of getting them signed.

I know of no lender that I have ever worked with that would take one of your reports unsigned by someone with a license and ag lenders like the signature to be CG.
 

Terrel L. Shields

Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
May 2, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Arkansas
I know of no lender that I have ever worked with that would take one of your reports unsigned by someone with a license and ag lenders like the signature to be CG.
Any community bank is free to use an evaluation below de minimus. Most community banks I know have accepted non-CG ag reports for below de minimus work and my farm has been eval'd by a non-licensed evaluator, and 2 CR. Any CG who stiffs a trainee isn't a good trainer, and making $1700 from a trainees own clients, the super ought to kiss their boots not the other way around.
 

Mark K

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2004
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Indiana
You are getting 50% as a trainee and you will make $1,700 this week. And you are complaining?
I didn't read where he did these in one week. I'm guessing he's trying to get paid for several week's work.

And if he's got that much time/effort invested and the supervisor isn't doing his part, he has every right to complain.

Most local banks in this area will lend on most ag land and small farm operations with a CR. I've done dozens of them over the years with ag land values ranging up to $4 Mil.
 

George Hatch

Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
California
Best to run it by not only the client but also the end user (if they're different parties) to see what their requirements are.

Another thing to consider is what happens if you and your supervising appraiser have a deal and that supervisor gets the idea that you're going around them. You could be 100% in the right and yet if they think they have a beef with you and decide to cut ties then that could put a severe crimp in your trajectory.

Everyone's situation is different, but if I were the dominant half of a supervisor-trainee relationship - and that's the only position I would ever take with a trainee - I wouldn't allow them to submit anything to any client without personally going over it myself. Fee or no fee, signature or no signature, if a trainee has my name on them the workproduct is going to go my way or not at all.

Your mileage may vary
 

Michigan CG

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Michigan
Any community bank is free to use an evaluation below de minimus. Most community banks I know have accepted non-CG ag reports for below de minimus work and my farm has been eval'd by a non-licensed evaluator, and 2 CR. Any CG who stiffs a trainee isn't a good trainer, and making $1700 from a trainees own clients, the super ought to kiss their boots not the other way around.
His question was could he submit appraisals by himself, not evaluations. Evals pay significantly less than appraisals and most community banks have their own sources for evals in-house.

Some states are pretty strict about license level, Illinois and Iowa being two of them. Illinois states that one cannot argue that 40 or 80 acres is a 1-4 unit residential property and has to be completed by a CG. Obviously all states interpret differently. Here in Michigan it seems no one cares.

When we talk about farms it can be more than just tillable ground. I know of no state that is going to allow a CR to do a cattle farm, dairy operation or a pig farm; Iowa has a lot of pigs, nine million last I heard.

Who said the trainee is getting stiffed? He is waiting on a signature. Obtaining his own clients. He would not have them without the signature of his mentor.
 

Michigan CG

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Michigan
Most local banks in this area will lend on most ag land and small farm operations with a CR. I've done dozens of them over the years with ag land values ranging up to $4 Mil.
Your posts show that you have more experience than the average bird. Most CR appraisers don't know the difference between loam, sand and clay and don't even know they should know those things. I doubt a local bank in Indiana is going to accept an appraisal from an Indianapolis CR who thinks five acres might be a farm.
 

Terrel L. Shields

Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
May 2, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Arkansas
His question was could he submit appraisals by himself, not evaluations
If not an FRT, here a registered appraiser (trainee) can appraise up to $250 k regardless commercial or residential. More than half my hours were commercial when I first licensed since all my mentors were CG and many hours were without a supervisor on commercial properties (mostly vacant land or small owner occupied retail.)
 

Michigan CG

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Michigan
If not an FRT, here a registered appraiser (trainee) can appraise up to $250 k regardless commercial or residential. ..........
I know of NO lenders who will accept an appraisal from someone who has only a trainee license. ESPECIALLY when there are many who have some sort of certification. Regulators exist.


.......... More than half my hours were commercial when I first licensed since all my mentors were CG and many hours were without a supervisor on commercial properties (mostly vacant land or small owner occupied retail.)
In 1492 when you got your license they were still unloading the Mayflower.
 
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