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Lender Hit With $71,000,000 Verdict.

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David C. Johnson

Thread Starter
Senior Member
Jan 15, 2002
Now, where was it I heard of this fine group before?


David C. Johnson, Raleigh
NC State-Certified General R.E. Appraiser


<mod edit>
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Thanks, Wayne.


After some thought, I believe the best way to handle newspaper articles is for the poster / "postee" to Write a Summary of the Article in their own words and include it along with the hyperlinked URL in the post without including the actual test of the article. Also, including some well chosen "search words" based on the text of the article may be a good idea.

We all understand the rationale for wishing to include the actual text of an article in one's post. URL address are often changed or disconnected. Then, someone reading the post does not get to read the article. That's irritating.

We also understand that while newspapers generally appreciate the additional exposure, they cannot allow individual members of the public to make such decisions for them on their own, so the copyright law remains as it is regardless of whether it is counterproductive for the paper or not.

Yes, another way to go about it is to contact the newspaper itself to get permission to post the text of the article, but this can be time consuming, and to add insult to injury, it will cost you a minimum of $25 dollars, but often more (mainly for their time in processing the request).

I have gone through this before: www.boardwatch.org/htmfiles/NewsObserver.htm . It took several telephone calls over several days followed-up with another wait while they checked out the venue where it was to appear after I faxed them an application. After looking at the website, the employee I worked with at the Raleigh News & Observer (and apparently her superiors), were clearly pleased that it was to appear on the site, but it still cost me $25, their lowest rate.

Including a few appropriate search words / terms (including the staff writer's name) in the post will help someone, later on, to locate the actual article itself from the online archives of the paper once the link is no longer valid. If I had more time and inclination, I would include such a summary for this article, and also provide the suggested search words. Maybe later on. Another possibility, but only applicable to advanced forums like this one with the capability to edit posts, is for the original postee to keep tracking the changing URL over time and keep updating the original post.

The thread titled "Mortgage Fraud In NC," with it's URLed article, was started on the same day as this thread. Occurring in Charlotte, NC, which is one of the nation's most important banking cities, that story is probably of more importance to us all. According to the FBI, it is reported to be the country's largest mortgage fraud case ever.

By the way, while it is lengthy, a very careful reading (i.e., a little "reading between the lines") of the hyperlinked newspaper article cited above from Boardwatch will provide about all one needs to know -- in a nutshell -- about why several of our state appraisal boards are in the mess they are in. For an even smaller nutshell, remember this: "Just follow the money."

One more "by the way." Near the end of that article, for those who have not read it already, you will read of an alleged bribery case (with the NC Board of Transportation) where the prospective board member raised total hell -- out loud and in public -- when his $30,000 was taken, but he did not get his board seat in return. The DA's case was greatly weakened when someone explained to the idiot-board-member-wannabe that if he was successful in "making his case" to the DA, that he would be guilty of attempted bribery!

His $30,000 was promptly returned.

Hunt was a very good governor overall, but man did he and/or his staff royally screw-up some of our state boards! The answer to many or most of the nation's state board problems is Campaign Finance Reform!



Jan 16, 2002

Very interesting, but once again, we must deal with the term "flipping" being used in an inappropriate manner.

What was going on has nothing at all to do with flipping.

Might as well use "flipping" in every murder case.

Brad Ellis, IFA,RAA

David Mullen

Junior Member
Jan 17, 2002
The fine is too low and I did not see any mention of the liars and cheats that authorized or originated these practices.

They should be sought out and after being personally sued and fined until they have absolutely no assets, they should spend the rest of their lives in prison. Nothing else willstop this from happening again unless the penalties are so overwhelming that it would not be worth it to do it again.

Nothing close to that will happen of course. When I was young and being given advice by an uncle, he said to find a way to make a living with a pencil. He said you will make far more with a pencil than you will with your hands and back.

He was not thinking of a life of crime but it certainly applies to criminals too. The rich who steal from the poor with their sleazy business practices, seldom if ever receive appropriate penalties.


Elite Member
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Licensed Appraiser
Note the last sentence THIS WILL BE APPEALED means cut to one quarter the amount with no wrong doing on thier part & Lawyers ALL walk away happy.

Residential Appraisal Ser

Sophomore Member
Jan 26, 2002
Brad: We are suing Cendant Mortgage on up charging appraisals without infroming the consumer. In November we were able to get HUD on our side of the issue by fining 52 Lenders and suspending a number of them for up charging appraisals and other services.
In April the Justice Department signed on as a friendly 3rd party.

We now are also after Fannie & Freddie for not backing loans with appraisals. As AFL-CIO has 3/4 of a trillion in pension funds with the Maes they have headed our warning about loans that have not be backed by real appraisals. We are starting a series of meetings concerning the above issues starting the 16th.

Our battle will be won in the halls of congress and economic clout. We welcome other organizations to join with us.

William Sentner
American Guild of Appraisers OPEIU AFL-CIO


Senior Member
Apr 23, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser

Can you provide a website where we can get more infor on your organization.


Bemis Pownall

make $21 million fined $1 million
Uncle Sam charges alot more then the justice system...

Don Clark

Elite Member
Jan 17, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser

Bill Sentner:

I had a long time friend who is a mortgage banker(yes, some of them are good enough to be friends with) stop by my office today. He was telling me about a lender who wanted to make a loan at $250.000 My friend had a complete residential appraisal completed with an interior inspection(URAR) that came in at $200.00 on the property. However, the lender had an AVM that came in at $250,000. The lender used the AVM. You have a long way to go Bill.



Senior Member
Jan 16, 2002
Brad Ellis
Have to agree with you 100%; the term "Flipping" is now being used way to often and for the wrong reason. In this instance "Deceptive Busines Practice" or "Misleading The Public" or "Misrepresentaion" or a host of others could be used, my favorite is the old "Bait & Switch" tactic. My feeling is the word "FLipping" has been misused to attempt to make a point, but it has to be supported by a fully supported "Attempt to Defraud" and a willfully & knowingly supported case structure.

To: William Sentner, have been following your input for sometime now and it seems your the more agressive force in the industry. Power appears to be in number of undivided people; as we stand divided on the many issues at every turn of the day - we will lack the power of change within our own industry.

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