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Low self esteem

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JimmyJames

Thread Starter
Freshman Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
I know that we don't discuss fees on this forum as that would be akin to the collusion that has been perpitrated by the Lenders to artificially hold our fees down to late 80's levels. I just recently found out that one of the major lenders in the Southeast has set up a computer system that assigns appraisal orders to approved appraisers where the main qualifiying condition is fee. The lower you fee the more assignments you will receive, regardless of the quality of the work. It seems to me that those of us that don't operate sweat shops where staff appraisers crank out 3 or 4 appraisals per day that aren't worth the paper they are printed on are at a distinct disadvantage under this corrupt system. However, I will not allow the "system" deter me from charging a fair fee for my expertise. If residential appraisal fees where to have kept pace with inflation over the past 25 years we would all be charging 1.5 times what the current rate is! The most intelligent thing I have ever read on this forum, which by the way is one of the best recourses in the appraisal industry, is the statement "double your fees and you will loose half your clients and make the same amount of money".

In closing if you suffer from low self esteem please allow someone who dosn't, set your fees.

p.s. where's the spell check on this gizmo?
 

jtrotta

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
Yep, your absolutely correct, the problem is these folks come & go because they eventually figure out there not making any money and are poor business people; but create havic in the industry.
 
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
Your right. I like the part about doubling fees and losing half of customers while making same amount. Why are lenders so concerned with cheap appraisal fees ? Fannie is constantly bashing appraisers over so-called
"high cost" of appraisal fees. Does anybody realize that appraisal fees are the cheapest cost in the entire process ? Who's kidding who here ? Appraisers are enabling these people (all in the chain, from builders to
bankers) to make millions.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
<span style='color:blue'>Power To The People!!

Looks like you're pushing the upper limits of the whining index on this one.

With all the improvements in technology you should have become more efficient and crank out more appraisals than you did back in the 80's without losing any time, accuracy, or proficiency. If you haven't become more efficient over the last 20 years, maybe you need to re-evaluate your processes.

Gas prices are the same as they were back in the 80's too. The oil producing countries aren't whining, they just sell more. Capitalism and competition are great aren't they?

You need to get to the Bookstore and buy "Who Moved My Cheese" by Spencer Johnson. It's all about dealing with change in your work environment and being able to see the writing on the wall.

Since you seem to still be living in the 80's might I suggest to "Just Say No!"

</span>
 

Dale Smalley

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Florida
I dont get your point. They are making a business decision to control costs and using technology to help. Sounds like a smart idea to me. How do sell them on a $350 report when they can get them for $300.
Our company orders REO appraisals so we have to know what they charge in each area. The corporate world cares little about relationships just the bottom line. If you want their business you have to compete with market. Because others charge a lower fee it does not mean they provide an inferior product.

Sell us Jimmy.
What do you have that is better?
How is the bean counter going to approve the increase in fees?
Do you really want this kind of work?
 
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
Toast & Dale:

The problem is that it's a one-way street with these people. How come the same technology hasn't lowered the cost of closings at the bank ? The lawyers also have technology and their fees have doubled. The list is endless, architects, surveyors, title insurance companies, etc. Name one person in the real estate chain lowering their fees ?

Regards,

Ranting Joe
 

Ruth Langkawel

Sophomore Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2002
Toast,

You may be unaware that there are large areas of the contry that do not have all of that wonderful computerized data. I work areas that have no online public records - in fact, no computerized public record look up at all. I'm required to spend hours in the county offices looking property by property through the tax rolls to find sales, then drive by each sale in order to determine the size, age and design of the home. The Assessor records are not available, because the Assessor works 3 hours a week - 8 to 11 AM on Saturday. The majority of sales are not through an MLS.

The other fallacy in your response is that you do not give a thought to the expense of the "technology". If a business invests in technology to make them more efficient, THEY should benefit from that investment - AND, they need to budget reimbursement, repair, maintenance and replacement reserves into the fee structure.



Dave Smalley,

How my product is more valuable than the low bidders:
1. I do thorough research, and have data to back up every box that I check, statistic that I report, and statement that I make. I don't pull it out of the air or say whatever will get past the underwriter.
2. I research the listing & sale history through local MLS AND through public records on each of the comparables, as well as the subject (as required by USPAP), and analyze what those histories might be saying about the sales price. I don't just let the defaulted "none found" statement ride for that section of the report with no research to verify it's accuracy.
3. I spend considerable time analyzing the actual differences between the properties and the market responses to those differences. My adjustments are supportable - whether they meet underwriting guidelines or not. They are not just minimal figures plugged in to assure that guidelines are not breached.
4. I take the time to adequately describe the subject. I don't just call everything average, average, average to keep from making adjustments at all.

IN OTHER WORDS, I give a Complete Appraisal with a well developed value conclusion based upon the specific attributes and condition of the subject - not a minimally researched, minimally described, minimally adjusted, minimally analyzed, unverified "average" for the neighborhood value (or a fraudulent one to make the deal close).

The industry complains about the quality of appraisal reports they are getting, while they hire only those appraisers that have so little respect for their profession that they accept fees that require ultra high volume in order to meet expenses and pay themselves minimum wage. Or they have an AMC do their hiring, and the AMC keeps half of the appraisal fee. How hard would you work for half pay?

Make up your mind - do you want a good appraisal, or a cheap one? If you buy cheap, don't complain about the quality. In fact, if you buy cheap, you would have been better off with an AVM. The value is likely to not be any more reliable, and the AVM should be even cheaper.

As my mechanic says, "You can pay me now - or you can pay me later."


Respectfully submitted :)
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Joe,

I agree that our fees seem to be dropping but could it be that they were over inflated to begin with? The market determines the sale price of a property, couldn't it be that the market is just re-adjusting itself to the cost of an appraisal? I don't know.

Ruth,

I'm sorry that you don't have property information readily available for you to use, but didn't you know that coming in? If you don't like your job, quit complaining and get a new one. And why are you being so high and mighty about your standards. The price of an appraisal does not guarantee it will be worth the money spent.

And there is nothing false about technology improving performance. Maybe you can't benefit from the technology but that's your tough luck.

Your statement reminded me of one of my favorite quotes.

"There is no reason for any individual to have a computer in his home."
Ken Olson, President, Digital Equipment, 1977

Lot's of crabby people today. Let's all go grab a beer and call it a weekend. Ruth, the first round is on me.

toast
 

Kathy in FL

Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
State
Florida
I charge pretty much what everybody else does for an appraisal in this rural market. I'm not getting rich. Not by any means. I live in a mortgaged triplewide on 40 mortgaged acres, drive a 98 minivan that won't be paid for for years, and owe Visa more than I ever dreamed I would. I do good quality work in a rural area without alot of data, and I can turn out one residential a day. My commercial work is pretty cheap and I can do one in two weeks or so. Lenders constantly are pressuring me to lower prices. I'd love to go up $50 on my fees.

But folks, I'm not complaining. I work out of my house. I can stop working, nurse my baby, feet my ferrets, and go back to work. If I need to take a kid to the dentist, I can, without risking getting fired. If somebody offers me a job that I think will be more trouble than its worth, I can say no. I can work on Saturday if I want. I can work at 2 AM on Wednesday if I want. I can get paid in puppies, smoked mullet, or sometimes even real money. I can take all afternoon to do an assignment because I decided to sit by the river and eat my lunch and play with my dog. I have 3 kids who don't know what day care is. People, this is a DAMNED good business for those of us in it for the long haul.

If you want to keep on complaining about how little you're paid, go ahead. Then go talk to a bank teller or somebody who actually has to work for a living.

Kathy in FL
 

TC

Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Pennsylvania
I agree with Kathy on this one, if you don't like the business, get out, but give me your client list before you leave!

tc
 
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