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No Red Tag? VA loan requirements? Appraiser? Realtor?

Rosebud1959

Thread Starter
Freshman Member
Joined
May 19, 2020
Professional Status
General Public
State
Idaho
I am new to this forum, so please forgive me if my post is not appropriate for discussion. My husband (a disabled af vet) and I purchased real property manufactured home and land in 2012 through his veteran status. Our lender said the appraiser could not locate the red tags, but then said it was okay and she and the realtor moved things on through. We were told the squeaking floor at the end of the house was due to normal settling.

We paid for a structural engineer and the report turn out find. We did not know any engineer and used the one suggested by the realtor. The loan went through.

About two months ago we sought a HE-Loc (Home equity loan) through our bank. Everything was find until we were told we needed a photo of our red tags, so we went looking and could not find any. I called the (now out of business) previous local Fleetwood dealer and was told to look on the outside of the home, at the A and B sections corner, but if they were not there, look under the home (permanent foundation) and look on the steel beams.

My disabled husband then crawled under the home -- I called Fleetwood manufacturing center. About the time he came up yelling "you won't believe what I found down there -- the back end is crunched in..." -- I came out to him with my jaw dropped to the floor, saying Fleetwood said we will not find red tags, because the home was totaled in transport and Fleetwood refused to put them on.

This brings up several questions: Why were we not told of the prior history of the home (we would simply have passed on purchase in the first place) -- and who's responsibility is it to make sure the title is clear and that red tags (proper certification) in place? This of course, now presents new problems for us, including we must now disclose what we now know in the event we ever want to sell the property.

Help please. And thank you.
 

EddieB

Elite Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2005
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
North Carolina
^^^^^^^^
Agree with above
 

glenn walker

Elite Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2006
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
California
I am new to this forum, so please forgive me if my post is not appropriate for discussion. My husband (a disabled af vet) and I purchased real property manufactured home and land in 2012 through his veteran status. Our lender said the appraiser could not locate the red tags, but then said it was okay and she and the realtor moved things on through. We were told the squeaking floor at the end of the house was due to normal settling.

We paid for a structural engineer and the report turn out find. We did not know any engineer and used the one suggested by the realtor. The loan went through.

About two months ago we sought a HE-Loc (Home equity loan) through our bank. Everything was find until we were told we needed a photo of our red tags, so we went looking and could not find any. I called the (now out of business) previous local Fleetwood dealer and was told to look on the outside of the home, at the A and B sections corner, but if they were not there, look under the home (permanent foundation) and look on the steel beams.

My disabled husband then crawled under the home -- I called Fleetwood manufacturing center. About the time he came up yelling "you won't believe what I found down there -- the back end is crunched in..." -- I came out to him with my jaw dropped to the floor, saying Fleetwood said we will not find red tags, because the home was totaled in transport and Fleetwood refused to put them on.

This brings up several questions: Why were we not told of the prior history of the home (we would simply have passed on purchase in the first place) -- and who's responsibility is it to make sure the title is clear and that red tags (proper certification) in place? This of course, now presents new problems for us, including we must now disclose what we now know in the event we ever want to sell the property.

Help please. And thank you.
The first thing I would do is get a copy of the engineers report to see what he had observed, then see if the seller had given you a transfer disclosure statement . In my state the seller answers a list of questions regarding condition and only things he /she knew about Then get all your paperwork together and research real estate attorneys in your community. The engineers report is the one I want to see- most engineers are fairly straight forward so maybe he did report it and nobody gave you a copy. The Listing Agent-The Selling Agent-The Sellers -The Engineer- One out of the four knew there was an-Issue. Now someone just has to shake the tree and go on a little fishing expedition..
 
Last edited:

Rosebud1959

Thread Starter
Freshman Member
Joined
May 19, 2020
Professional Status
General Public
State
Idaho
You need to speak with an attorney. Something does not sound right about your situation.
I am new to this forum, so please forgive me if my post is not appropriate for discussion. My husband (a disabled af vet) and I purchased real property manufactured home and land in 2012 through his veteran status. Our lender said the appraiser could not locate the red tags, but then said it was okay and she and the realtor moved things on through. We were told the squeaking floor at the end of the house was due to normal settling.

We paid for a structural engineer and the report turn out find. We did not know any engineer and used the one suggested by the realtor. The loan went through.

About two months ago we sought a HE-Loc (Home equity loan) through our bank. Everything was find until we were told we needed a photo of our red tags, so we went looking and could not find any. I called the (now out of business) previous local Fleetwood dealer and was told to look on the outside of the home, at the A and B sections corner, but if they were not there, look under the home (permanent foundation) and look on the steel beams.

My disabled husband then crawled under the home -- I called Fleetwood manufacturing center. About the time he came up yelling "you won't believe what I found down there -- the back end is crunched in..." -- I came out to him with my jaw dropped to the floor, saying Fleetwood said we will not find red tags, because the home was totaled in transport and Fleetwood refused to put them on.

This brings up several questions: Why were we not told of the prior history of the home (we would simply have passed on purchase in the first place) -- and who's responsibility is it to make sure the title is clear and that red tags (proper certification) in place? This of course, now presents new problems for us, including we must now disclose what we now know in the event we ever want to sell the property.

Help please. And thank you.
caveat emptor
There should be more than the burden on disabled veterans. The realtors are to be professionals. But, yes, every person should do their homework as well. Thanks for your simple reminder.
 

Rosebud1959

Thread Starter
Freshman Member
Joined
May 19, 2020
Professional Status
General Public
State
Idaho
You need to speak with an attorney. Something does not sound right about your situation.
We spoke with an attorney. The answer was the biggest hurdle is statute of limitations versus fraud -- who knew what and where did the chain of information go -- why was there no disclosure.
 

CANative

Elite Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2003
Professional Status
Retired Appraiser
State
California
Oh boy. Sorry to read about this. I'm a vet with a service connected disability too, so give your husband my best regards.

Lots of blame to go around here. First off, VA loans are different than most loans. Most conventional lenders and government programs (FHA and USDA for instance) will only accept manufactured homes that were built to a national building code, informally called "HUD Code.") The only way to tell the difference is the data plate and labels (the labels are the "red tags" you described which arre not always red. They come in several colors or no color.) The data plate is a paper label inside of the house. It's a sticker about the size of a legal size printer paper, has a picture of the United States, and a bunch of information. It might be in a kitchen cabinet, the laundry room cabinet or a bedroom closet (usually the master bedroom.) If you can find that, you've struck gold (regarding qualifying for a conventional or Gov. insured loan.)

VA has more relaxed standards because, well, because Vets have earned it. They don't necessarily require HUD code construction and that might be why your loan went through without the HUD data found on the label and plates. The data label numbers are etched or welded on the chassis (I beam frame underneath) but they are very hard to find for some unfamiliar with finding them and especially for an older or disabled person. At least for me.

If they were to find them, there is a process for applying for a verification letter attesting to construction under the HUD code and that would probably make things easier.

As it stands now, you will have a major issue refinancing without those verifications. There are sources for private loans that might have competitive terms.

As far as the damage, that is not good. One cannot just saw some boards up and nail the chassis and other components back together. You would need someone that specializes in manufactured homes and who knows how to obtain necessary permits and approvals by your States manufactured home agency.

Good luck.
 

andrew81

Senior Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2008
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Illinois
You need to speak with an attorney. Something does not sound right about your situation.
i am not a fan of lawsuit culture and cringe every time some one here suggests speaking to an attorney, but, this time I fully agree, something fishy is going on here and i suggest getting an attorney to help sort it out
 

CANative

Elite Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2003
Professional Status
Retired Appraiser
State
California
I totally missed this part:

I came out to him with my jaw dropped to the floor, saying Fleetwood said we will not find red tags, because the home was totaled in transport and Fleetwood refused to put them on.

:eek:
 
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