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Was Joan Right?

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J Grant

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Dec 9, 2003
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Certified Residential Appraiser
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Florida
I have a simple yet effective idea that can solve everything . Will send it to FHFA , it makes so much sense they'l reject it. Appraisal modernization could take many paths but there is only so much you can "modernize" without the product becoming so far removed from what an appraisal is that the product is worthless. Imo their "plan" is in cut appraisals into a piecemeal fast food product to the point of worthless but since fannie/freddie are the power users they are willing to do that unless outside pushback is strong enough or enough investors get hurt..

I always questioned the waivers and posted before on concern that even if borrower is strong, what happens if in the future borrower takes out additional loans and over leverages the property.....one post here mentioned discoveries that a high % of properties that got waivers are turning around and getting refinances and HELOC's. Big surprise...fannie owns the "data collections" on properties they order a DC on and can make them available to lenders who can solicit borrowers to heap on additional loans since no appraisal is needed! Just pile the loans on , bring it on, fannie has a DC on file all is good !
 

George Hatch

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Jan 15, 2002
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Certified General Appraiser
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California
Breaking the appraisal process into different tranches consisting of skilled vs semi-skilled isn't an example of "muuhdrnzation". Appraisers have used runners and date entry clerks to do the dumb work since before any of us got into appraising.

Bringing the process more current compared to Fannie's "form drives the process" approach would normally be considered to consist primarily of leveraging technology. For instance, automatically merging data from different sources, displaying them in a map mode that automatically updates the results every time you change the parameters, keylogging every change to the criteria that you make as you search along with the results of that iteration, logging which records you looked at more closely, and so on. Presumably the analytics could be working in the background and the changes to those resulting R2 factors and trendlines could be logged as well. Then load the final results into an electronic reporting folder from which various reports can be produced.

But regardless how you wrangle the data and make your comparisons, qualifying the data on the consistent basis will remain the most difficult and time consuming part of the process. Regardless of who does it.

Looking downrange, it may come to pass that it eventually ends up taking more time, effort and skill to perform the data qualification well than to analyze the data and reconcile for the value.

Computer repair used to be a skilled job that paid well. Not just anyone had what it took to learn how to diagnose and repair the hardware and install/configure the hardware. However, that was only a marketable skill for a brief window in time. The advances of the technology and manufacturing quickly rendered those skills obsolete.

And here's the potential lesson for us: the more sophisticated the tech becomes the fewer skills it takes to use it. The same kid who is only nominally literate may be quite adept at setting up and operating the 1001 applications they have for their iPhone.
 
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Terrel L. Shields

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May 2, 2002
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Arkansas
I hear Joan is on her way to meet with Maxine Waters. You may not like her business model but she is on our side.
 

J Grant

Elite Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2003
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Florida
Breaking the appraisal process into different tranches consisting of skilled vs semi-skilled isn't an example of "muuhdrnzation". Appraisers have used runners and date entry clerks to do the dumb work since before any of us got into appraising.

the subject inspection/ comps and area inspection is not dumb work, it is the backbone of the appraisal ( when an inspection is part of the appraisal ). Perhaps why for decades a certified appraiser an assignment condition to inspect and if a trainee inspected they were supervised with disclosure. The fact that fannie decided to allow non appraisers to "data collect " ( they stop short of saying inspection lest it cross into into licensed practice ) does not erase history

Appraisers using runners to inspect was often not accepted by many clients, but but if acceptable and appraiser uses a runner it is their choice and a person they can select /interact with, not a decision thrust on them /done by a random disconnected person.

Fannie calls it it modernization but it's simply a downgrade to using a non appraiser runner , the most low tech , inefficient and low rent idea they could have come up with.
 
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fritzvogel

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2004
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
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New York
WHO IS JOAN ANYWAY???
 

chad hampton

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2006
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
North Carolina
Breaking the appraisal process into different tranches consisting of skilled vs semi-skilled isn't an example of "muuhdrnzation". Appraisers have used runners and date entry clerks to do the dumb work since before any of us got into appraising.

the subject inspection/ comps and area inspection is not dumb work, it is the backbone of the appraisal ( when an inspection is part of the appraisal ). Perhaps why for decades a certified appraiser an assignment condition to inspect and if a trainee inspected they were supervised with disclosure. The fact that fannie decided to allow non appraisers to "data collect " ( they stop short of saying inspection lest it cross into into licensed practice ) does not erase history

Appraisers using runners to inspect was often not accepted by many clients, but but if acceptable and appraiser uses a runner it is their choice and a person they can select /interact with, not a decision thrust on them /done by a random disconnected person.

Fannie calls it it modernization but it is a downgrade to using a appraiser runner , the most low tech , inefficient and low rent idea they could have come up with.
I agree with what you're saying, but runners is a buzzword. I would never condone the use of unlicensed 'runners' to be involved in the appraisal process. This is what some of those esteemed chief valuation officers at AMCs are pushing. What they could have been condoning is more use of licensed trainees. IMO, it is derogatory to call trainees "runners".

As far as calling the field appraisal work 'dumb work' - my supervisor told me on day 1, before he worked with me, to not get too comfortable. He said he tried training 5 people prior to me and none could get the field inspection part right. Most couldn't measure the home and no idea what they were doing in the field. This might be surprising, but most people have little to no understanding of even basic home construction. You can tell the suits that have been pushing hybrids have very little practical experience in this field. Maybe they were all decent appraisers in the 80's, but since then they must have lost their minds.

I'm with djd on the news about her possibly meeting with rep waters. Guess I have reserved optimism. I don't know JT, never met her - so I take folks criticism of her with a grain of salt. But there are a lot of appraisers that I respect - appraisers that I'm 100% confident have appraiser's best interest in mind all the times. I'd prefer if 1 of them were meeting with congress.
 

Evincere

Elite Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
Florida
I hear Joan is on her way to meet with Maxine Waters. You may not like her business model but she is on our side.
Oh pluuuz. . You do realize that Protec, Class valuation AMCs (who are desperately seeking appraisers to do their hybrids and bifurcated reports) are Among her regular expo sponsors?

listen to the last pod cast Phil made that you posted. He comments about how during a CRN meeting Joan supposedly broke the shocking news to to a room of heavily invested hybrid software AMCs.

Don’t think for one minute Joan is scurrying off to Maxines office on behalf of anyone but her clients interests who support her financial interests via membership and sponsorship
 
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Terrel L. Shields

Thread Starter
Elite Member
Gold Supporting Member
Joined
May 2, 2002
Professional Status
Certified General Appraiser
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Arkansas
She is against waivers at least
 
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chad hampton

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2006
Professional Status
Certified Residential Appraiser
State
North Carolina
Oh pluuuz. . You do realize that Protec, Class valuation AMCs (who are desperately seeking appraisers to do their hybrids and bifurcated reports) are but a few of her regular expo sponsors?
Damn, why did you have to remind us all of that? :rof:
 
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