NAR - Appraisal Institute

[Francois K. Gregoire]

Agents and brokers, by their very basic fiduciary relationship with their clients, are not interested in "doing right" with regard to market value. If they are a selling agent, they want the highest possible price for their client. If they are a buyer broker, they want the lowest possible price for their client. Let's not even get into the conflict of interest associated with someone paid by commission trying to get the lowest possible price.

That relationship and their obligations to their client or customer is governed by state license laws. An appraiser's relationship to the client is governed by the USPAP and state license laws. Real estate brokers and real estate appraisers are allowed to be in the same room with one another and may even belong to the same organizations.

Can you point to any rule, regulation or policy that says otherwise?

I have, on two occasions in the past, actively participated in the RE sales profession. I left both times because of the open, blatent, even expected less than ethical conduct by the sales agents. I had a "top producer" advise me, on one particular deal with some minor issues, to "just lie to them". "Them" being my client. I have observed top producers repeatedly pay fines to the MLS service for purposely reporting inaccurate data in the MLS with the reasoning that is was just a "cost of business". As an appraiser, I have been repeatedly lied to, threatened, yelled at, told it was my "job to support the contract", refused information, given long lists of irrelevant information as part of a reconsideration of value process, etc, etc, etc. I have sat in the back of a sales training class and listened to a broker from a "top producing" office bad-mouth appraisers until such time as he asked why some people were nervously laughing. When it was noted that an appraiser was in the class, he, being the smartass that he was, suggested perhaps I would like to teach the class. Which I did for a couple of other class members during a break because the broker couldn't teach his way out of paper bag.

Salespeople and brokers: the great unwashed? It is a perception they seem all to eager to project.

At face value, I will take everything you say. No argument with your life experience and perception.

Now, take a look at the comments on this very bulletin board about some of our appraisal brethren, many of which are less than complimentary with respect to their competency, their ethics, the capabilities and their professionalism. Is it possible there are some among us deserving of such disdain?

Attend a meeting of your state appraisal regulatory board. I've attended about 46 over the last 7.5 years and have seen some unbelievable things. Firsthand, I have observed open, blatant, even expected less than ethical conduct by real estate appraisers. I have examined cases involving criminal conduct by real estate appraisers, including designated members of the "Big Four" Appraisal Organizations. Does that taint the entire profession?

Why do Realtor appraisers request education from NAR? I think it is a reasonable assumption that it is because they don't want to pay the higher expense associated with AI educational offerings. Will AI offer discounts to NAR members as a result of the affiliation? How does that benefit AI? As a designated AI member, that is my question. What is the benefit of the relationship to me? I don't really care about the benefit to Realtor-appraisers. I understand their perceived advantages.

Realtor Appraisers want education from their organization. I do not believe that the AI will discount courses for non-members, even if the affiliation happens. Why should they? The AI will, however, have a much easier method of marketing their education and other services within the NAR family of institutes, societies and councils. The AI already has agreements with the CCIM's.

Kenneth, since I am not a member of the AI, the true benefits to their members should probably come from their leadership. I'm sure they have, or are developing an information piece for you all.

 

[Todd Ruhl]

Very well put, Kenneth! Undoubtedly, there are many appraisers that share your view and have experienced similar situations. I'd rather see the profession strive for "distinction" rather than "affiliation".

 

[TC]

Since most people on this board don't belong to the AI, why do you care what they do? You don't have a dog in the fight.

TC

 

[Todd Ruhl]

Since most people on this board don't belong to the AI, why do you care what they do? You don't have a dog in the fight.

TC

Are you familiar with "Amicus curiae" ?

 

[TC]

You tell me me, Latin Boy.

friend of the court

 

[Ken B]

Real estate brokers and real estate appraisers are allowed to be in the same room with one another and may even belong to the same organizations.

I don't disagree at all. Some of my best friends are real estate agents. (Stated tongue in cheek, understanding the context of the statement)

Now, take a look at the comments on this very bulletin board about some of our appraisal brethren, many of which are less than complimentary with respect to their competency, their ethics, the capabilities and their professionalism. Is it possible there are some among us deserving of such disdain?

Absolutely. The difference being that, in my experience, agents and brokers who are successful can pretty much get away with murder and then be awarded for it and subsequently admired by their peers. Same in any profession where income is commissioned based. Not so in the appraisal profession

Attend a meeting of your state appraisal regulatory board. I've attended about 46 over the last 7.5 years and have seen some unbelievable things. Firsthand, I have observed open, blatant, even expected less than ethical conduct by real estate appraisers. I have examined cases involving criminal conduct by real estate appraisers, including designated members of the "Big Four" Appraisal Organizations. Does that taint the entire profession?

Been there, done that, agree completely. What does this have to do with a NAR-AI affiliation.

Realtor Appraisers want education from their organization. I do not believe that the AI will discount courses for non-members, even if the affiliation happens. Why should they? The AI will, however, have a much easier method of marketing their education and other services within the NAR family of institutes, societies and councils. The AI already has agreements with the CCIM's.

AI lacks market awareness among appraisal professionals? Don't think so. I am an AI affiliate member of CCIMs STDB. Use it on every report I create. Love it, love it, love it.

Kenneth, since I am not a member of the AI, the true benefits to their members should probably come from their leadership. I'm sure they have, or are developing an information piece for you all.

The AI leadership has promised to keep the membership advised. I am willing to keep an open mind about the whole thing. We will see what happens.

 

[Francois K. Gregoire]

Been there, done that, agree completely. What does this have to do with a NAR-AI affiliation.

Kenneth,

It has nothing to do with NAR-AI affiliation. It was included in response to your described observations of real estate licensees. My only point was there are bad apples in every barrel.

Have you ever heard surveyors discuss their competition? How about barbers, hardressers, contractors, etc.

The AI leadership has promised to keep the membership advised. I am willing to keep an open mind about the whole thing. We will see what happens.

That's great!! All the best.

 

[Workbox]

The AI should only be for Education and that is it. The NAR may learn more from the AI and that is it. And there should be a new Appraiser organization created.

 

[Lee Lansford]

...I'd rather see the profession strive for "distinction" rather than "affiliation".

What? We can't have both in one?

 

[Todd Ruhl]

What? We can't have both in one?

Not by affiliating with an association of real estate salespeople. In my opinion, this type of affiliation would do nothing more than dilute the distinction of the appraisal profession. I have the utmost respect for the National Association of Realtors, but they certainly don't represent my interests as an appraiser...and I don't expect them to change. We obviously have some common interests, but the reality is that the NAR will always support those issues that benefit the Realtor. I'm not trying to offend, but to believe otherwise is completely naive.