Let the borrower order it. The case for it.

[SANDY]

Marcia:

I hear ya-what is ethical and what is not is getting to be more and more difficult especially with the near daily barage of temptations diguised in the many forms many lenders utilize not to mention the downright threats we periodically receive. I can assure you thatthis office is highly ethical but tired of the constant crap the lenders get away with every day. Just another day in the life of an appraiser.

 

[Greenback]

Anyone can order an appraisal for their own purposes and in any given mortgage transaction the various parties can each order their own appraisal.

The intended use for each of the various parties would be different. I can't imagine a regulated lender (as opposed to a private lender) making a lending decision based on an appraisal where the intended use was to make a borrowing decision.

Per USPAP, the client is always an intended user but there may be additional intended users. Are you suggesting that the appraisals should have more than one intended use?

I'm trying to imagine how that would look.

"... for the client to make a borrowing decision and the additional user to make a lending decision? ..."

I'm not liking that very much. I'd much prefer the status quo of each party obtaining a separate appraisal and each appraisal being for a single intended use.

One intended use and several intended users. Each intended user may have their role disclosed, as it pertains to the intended use. A borrower may be a client and the lender may be an intended user, along with the underwriter and LO/MB (vice versa). The borrower, also may be wanting to make a mortgage lending decision, just as the lender may want to make a mortgage lending decision (one is selling and another is buying). I see both the borrower and lender making a mortgage lending decision, with a different described role pertaining to the intended use.


I have an idealistic mind...
(I guess)

Sincerely,

 

[john snyder]

Greenback,

Well said for this thread.

How is it a threat to anyones risk if the intended use is financing and multiple intended users rely on it? Isn't that what we do today anyway?

Take the exerted undue pressure away from the mtg.brker/banker at the outset and let the borrower decide who is going to get the job.

Who can exert more undue influence? Isn't that what we are trying to move away from?

It won't be perfect but at least the corporate world won't be able to restrict trade based on undue influence. They can't cut you off do to lack of cooperation in "hitting" a number because they are not the client - they may be an intended user but they have no purse strings with you.

They may be able to influence via referrals who they like, however when they refer business out then they may be liable if the appraiser mucks it up by not doing a USPAP compliant job.

Erego - let the borrower order it. Let the mtg/bank/AMC review it for compliance.


jbs

 

[David Beasley]

Letting a homeowner or buyer choose the appraiser would never work, period. That was the crux of the "VA Appraiser Select" bill a few years ago that was an attempt to dismantle the VA fee panel in favor of "allowing" the veteran to choose their own appraiser. Problem is, not many veterans, home owners, or home buyers KNOW any appraisers. So what does that leave us? Of course, it leaves the agents or lenders to choose "their" favorite appraiser for the buyer or refinancer.

Even if the homeowner or buyer DID know an appraiser, then the undue influence effect is in play. How would it look for a "friend" that is also an appraiser to come in "low"? Hmmm. A friend will help you move. A true friend will help you move a body. A true friend that is an appraiser would NEVER appraise your home.

No, we need some sort of honest and genuinely disinterested 3rd party of some sort. Yes, I know it is a tall order, but is what is needed. The problem is, how much will this (or these) third parties cost us. Some one has to pay, you know it will be us, in reduced fees.

 

[Lost Cause]

Time To Get Real!

A homeowner, or anyone else for that matter, can order an appraisal any time they like and they can choose whomever the please for the assignment. They always could.

So why do folks want to deny a lender their choice of appraisers? After all it's their (or their depositors') money they are handing out. Those taking the risk get to choose.

Letting borrowers impose an appraiser on lenders is utterly absurd.

 

[TC]

So whenever a borrower wants a loan, they simply show up at the bank with an appraisal and it's accepted. What an opportunity for Skippy! I can only imagine the inflated values that will bring.

TC

 

[john snyder]

No TC the appraisal must be reviewed and conform to USPAP. Like in the old days with someone actually minding the store.

Borrower does not get to just walk in and submit any old appraisal - unless that is the way that bank does biz.

Right now my suggestion is based on the proposed new changes. Changes that may have some kind of round robin way of ordering the appraisal. No mtg/bank contact.

I liked the idea of round robin when I was first approved for FHA panel some 30 yrs. ago. Soon as that list went out the window so did about 95% of my FHA biz. Skippy took right over. So bring it back.

However, even in a round robin we are still going to contact the homeowner/borrower for access who is going to bend our ear and this probably won't deter lenders from calling the appraisers.

I am trying to look at this from an appraisers best perspective and not the lenders quality control that according my first post is the root of the this evil. In the old days collect at the door, send the job out. Nobody kept 40% of the gross.

Anyway to think letting the borrower order the appraisal would eliminate all undue influence is fallacy. However maybe the undue pressure would be less then a lender that can put you on a do not use list for NOT being skippy.

Basically a round robin may help the appraiser who practices sound Std1 and Std2 policy.

I am just posting this to open up all the options.

Where would this "let the borrower order it" be any different then the other choices buyers have in the open market be it lawyer,dds,md,cpa,plumber or carpenter? In this day and age people trade millions and billions just on ebay based on ratings of sellers. Most borrowers today can research an appraiser well before they come out to the property.

Sure the lenders want a list and that is fine. Then to be truly fair if there is a list then let the borrower choose from the list, or they can bring in a USPAP compliant appraisal and if it needs to be reviewed pay a review fee.

Oh and please, stop dunning appraisers for required extra work, pocketing the difference, and call it fair and square. It ain't fair - its undue influence to have a lender say -well we will just move that assignment to someone who will do it for that fee - with no regard to the borrower. An informed borrower that point if in fact when informed, may insist on putting in the extra fee to get the job done right for risk analysis, but is never informed of that option because it is rarely presented.

"The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten".
(I knew i would remember that eventually.)

Hmm that round robin is sounding better.

jbs

 

[Lee Lansford]

Sure...allow the borrower to engage the appraiser. Potential borrowers are fully competent and ethical in making such decisions...no doubt about it. I am certain that a property owner...realizing that the opinion of MV must be (say) $300K in order for the owner to refinance out of an ARM to a new fixed rate loan wouldn't THINK of shopping around for the "best" appraiser.

OK...what's the next suggestion?

 

[PropertyEconomics]

Sure...allow the borrower to engage the appraiser. Potential borrowers are fully competent and ethical in making such decisions...no doubt about it. I am certain that a property owner...realizing that the opinion of MV must be (say) $300K in order for the owner to refinance out of an ARM to a new fixed rate loan wouldn't THINK of shopping around for the "best" appraiser.

OK...what's the next suggestion?

I made it very early on in this thread ... ALL appraisal reports done for mortgage lending purposes will be required to be reviewed by someone certified a minimum of five years. I dont care who orders the report.

 

[Mr Rex]

Sure...allow the borrower to engage the appraiser. Potential borrowers are fully competent and ethical in making such decisions...no doubt about it. I am certain that a property owner...realizing that the opinion of MV must be (say) $300K in order for the owner to refinance out of an ARM to a new fixed rate loan wouldn't THINK of shopping around for the "best" appraiser.

OK...what's the next suggestion?

Umm, I need to get out of this onerous PMI. Can you help a poor starving family and their children out? Think of the children.

Have you no heart or soul, you pompous "ethical" appraiser that just cashed my check and I don't get my wishes and desires fulfilled? You will be hearing from my attorney, I will file a complaint with the state board, and I want my money back now, or I'm really going to get ugly with you, you POS.

Sounds like the answer to me.:new_smile-l: