Adapt or Die?

[Mike Boyd]

What reason is their to use a realtor for this type of work, other than "fast and cheap"? And, where has that put us over the last several years?

Slow and expensive?

Just don't do them. Don't let 'em see you sweat!

BPOs are beneath the dignity of a real appraiser.

 

[JSmith43]

BPOs are beneath the dignity of a real appraiser.

Well, that means doing BPO's is worse than:

Walking through doggie dew to measure a perimeter.

Providing 4th and 5th comps to bracket an UW's concern for an out of date guideline.

Negotiating SOW with an out of State MB.

Suffering Cert 23 edicts.

Standing as blamed for the S & L crisis.

In the process of being blamed for the housing bubble.

Residential appraisers are saddled with worse affront to dignity every day by certain aspects of their jobs.

I don't think dignity has anything to do with restraint of trade under the color of law/regulation. I think it was an accidental restraint for many of the law makers, but they weren't all that concerned about it in any case.

The NAR didn't have a dog in the fight, since NAR and AI had parted company.

 

[JSmith43]

I think it is more than that, if most of the residential appraisals were accurate, the users would see little reason to use BPOs. The fact is, they aren't getting what they want and need from appraisals.

Precisely. But that is hard to see. Mike, Stone, Webbed all should be proud of their obvious knowledge and experience regarding the appraisal profession. However, sometimes very talented people would rather work part time at a convenience store.

Einstein spent 7 years as a patent clerk. When he was young, he could barely suffer through traditional structured learning. I have always fancied myself as feeling the same way in USPAP CE

Solving point value UWG tiebreakers for mortgage business participants was probably not your personal HBU at any point in your career. Many parts of the typical assignment are burger flipper easy. Stick with the more challenging assignments, if that pleases you. Most appraisers prefer cookie cutters, regardless of their personal talent, IMO.

Don't any of you know some talented people that quit a high pressure job to open up a motorcycle shop, became professional fishing guides, golfers, something like that?

 

[Stone]

Precisely. But that is hard to see. Mike, Stone, Webbed all should be proud of their obvious knowledge and experience regarding the appraisal profession. However, sometimes very talented people would rather work part time at a convenience store.

Einstein spent 7 years as a patent clerk. When he was young, he could barely suffer through traditional structured learning. I have always fancied myself as feeling the same way in USPAP CE

Solving point value UWG tiebreakers for mortgage business participants was probably not your personal HBU at any point in your career. Many parts of the typical assignment are burger flipper easy. Stick with the more challenging assignments, if that pleases you. Most appraisers prefer cookie cutters, regardless of their personal talent, IMO.

Don't any of you know some talented people that quit a high pressure job to open up a motorcycle shop, became professional fishing guides, golfers, something like that?

I have no idea where you are going with this. (Really...not giving you a hard time)

 

[JSmith43]

I have no idea where you are going with this. (Really...not giving you a hard time)

DDNMA bottom lined it (customers that need a valuation product appraisers apparently can't/won't deliver) and I was musing about the emotional reactions of some of the talented and reliable posters to the prospect of offering a BPO level of product by people with appraisal background vs broker/agent only background.

Does that help?

 

[Stone]

DDNMA bottom lined it (customers that need a valuation product appraisers apparently can't/won't deliver) and I was musing about the emotional reactions of some of the talented and reliable posters to the prospect of offering a BPO level of product by people with appraisal background vs broker/agent only background.

Does that help?

It does. But, you can drop the condescending "emotional" aspect of your argument. Particularly considering I haven't written anything saying others shouldn't provide whatever service they can. I've done the opposite and stated that it can be done already.

I have no idea why anyone would want to work for that kind of pay, but I haven't argued against others doing it.

There shouldn't be any working outside of regulations for those who wish to do that type of work, however. People who call themselves appraisers who want to offer opinions of value are offering "appraisals". As long as that is the case they must (and should) abide by the standards that are applicable to our profession.

Allowing some assignments under USPAP while others can be done outside of those standards would only further add to the confusion so many have when they say things like "I don't want an appraisal...I only want to know what its worth".

One last time: It can be done. It can be done and be USPAP compliant. Frankly, it wouldn't be that hard after some time spent setting up a shell document. But, it still would pay lousy and I cannot see how anyone outside of a large shop would want to offer this type of product. However, if they wish to do so, USPAP allows an appraiser to produce this type of work.

 

[JSmith43]

It does. But, you can drop the condescending "emotional" aspect of your argument. Particularly considering I haven't written anything saying others shouldn't provide whatever service they can. I've done the opposite and stated that it can be done already.

I detected a pattern. This little compilation below from your recent posts on this thread isn't my imagination. I am totally unopposed to changing the wording I used "emotional reaction" to, say, rhetorical mantra. Is that OK?
I offer up rhetorical mantra quite a bit actually:icon_mrgreen: It depends on the topic.

Post 146: Now you are back to just wanting to do the garbage work without the limitations and responsibilities that come with being an appraiser.

Post 146 (continued) Is it more work for an appraiser to do the garbage work than it is for a realtor?

Post 150: There is no such thing as a report or SOW language that couldn't be picked apart here. Not for the garbage you are discussing

Post 152: What makes it more difficult for this type of nonsense product than for a different appraisal product?

Post 160: Personally, I'd rather let the realtors do this type of garbage

 

[SANDY]

Stone:

You have been throwing some big stones at the concept while at the same time stating that you have no problem with some appraisers competing for this type of business. There are many many garbage full appraisals out there!

Mentor:

I have been enjoying your posts! Especially number 162. I call that stuff "poundage" along with much of the other information that is required as part of the appraisal process as it has evolved. Now do not get me wrong---sometimes this poundage is extremely relevant to value but much of the time appraisers (imho) are being used as information go-fers. That's why we get the stupid requests for 2 more perfect comps etccc---- It's because our value didn't match their avm or quick and dirty value estimate and now we must be punished for standing in the way of their quick profit! That's really the only logical reason I can think of for the request for 2 more perfect comps-they can't be that stupid and think that we held those comps back so it's goota be because they have some fast and cheap estimate that is a different number and by requesting additional support for our number that they know cannot be provided is an attempt to make the appraiser either look bad or at least uncooperative!

 

[SANDY]

I detected a pattern. This little compilation below from your recent posts on this thread isn't my imagination. I am totally unopposed to changing the wording I used "emotional reaction" to, say, rhetorical mantra. Is that OK?
I offer up rhetorical mantra quite a bit actually:icon_mrgreen: It depends on the topic.

Post 146: Now you are back to just wanting to do the garbage work without the limitations and responsibilities that come with being an appraiser.
Post 146 (continued) Is it more work for an appraiser to do the garbage work than it is for a realtor?

Post 150: There is no such thing as a report or SOW language that couldn't be picked apart here. Not for the garbage you are discussing

Post 152: What makes it more difficult for this type of nonsense product than for a different appraisal product?

Post 160: Personally, I'd rather let the realtors do this type of garbage

Stone:
I don't really want to argue with you because I understand some of your points, but these types of labels point to a logic of----extend someone's views to a ridiculous extent and then point out the flaws in it. Appraisers can provide "less reliable" products while at the same time provide "more reliable" products without a whole lot of real confusion on the part of our clients. They are not as stupid as we think they are-on the contrary they are capable of asking for what they want or need--and let them take the responsibilty for asking for what "they" want-time for us to shirk that liability and not be so insistant that we know what you should be asking for.

 

[SANDY]

REALITY CHECK---

Values are being established everywhere everyday with these "garbage" products. Then the appraisers come along with one of their poundage reports that use the sales completed using the garbage products---end result = GARBAGE POUNDAGE!