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Cost Approach and those who "mail it in"

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Investors would be buying because the sales prices (used in the SCA?) make economic sense in light of rent levels and demand. Lower sales prices will yield lower market extracted GRMs--can you see the connection? The approaches are all inter-related.

Yes, the approaches are all interconnected, and when we divide sales prices by GRM the value can be SCA value

Say what--when SP divided by GRM one gets gross rent, n'est pas?

...however, on the accompanying income and expense statement, that spells it out in real dollars . Does the rental income support, or exceed the expenses (including mtge ), or does the income not support the payments? This, the profit after expenses, is how investors measure whether to buy our not.

In the previous high price market, the income did not cover expenses, no matter how an appraiser played with the GRM , so how did you account for that?

Was the typically investor in this high price market an investor?

Underwriters rely heavily on that as well, which they should.

What underwriters do is not my concern!

Investors purchase the future--in a "high price market" an investor may be anticipating rent increases and/or cashing out with additional equity if he anticipates values continuing to rise. Such info should be discovered in discussions with brokers, agents, buyers, sellers, etc.

There is no need to "play" with anything. It is what it is--the GRM reflects the thoughts of the typical investor if the GRM is extracted from a sale to a typical investor.
 
The certification on the form defines the value as Market Value. Therefore the "value" indicated by the cost approach is Market Value.

I don't understand where you're going with this.
 
Pittsburgh P, what area of FL is the Appraial God visitng?

I am in S FL (Plam Beach County). You should buy property here it is a great time to buy!
 
Pittsburgh P, what area of FL is the Appraial God visitng?

I am in S FL (Plam Beach County). You should buy property here it is a great time to buy!

Will be in Orlando at the ESPN zone--AAU volleyball tournament. Will be in Tampa before and Ormond Beach after.

As my late father used to tell cold callers from investment firms, I can't buy at this time--my money is tied up in livestock (my children).
 
The certification on the form defines the value as Market Value. Therefore the "value" indicated by the cost approach is Market Value.

I don't understand where you're going with this.

And I've pointed this out several times in several different threads, but it never gets addressed.

The idea that someone is completing an appraisal assignment and completing an approach to value within that assignment but doesn't complete that approach with the objective of concluding market value is a fundamental flaw in valuation practice.

As I've posted before (and will post again), there are 8-steps in the valuation process as taught by the recognized texts. Texts that are cited by numerous authorities (such as the Board of Equalization in their assessment handbook when discussing how to appraise real property).




The first step is "Identification of the Problem". Within that first step includes the following:
  • Identify client and intended users
  • Identify the intended use
  • Identify the purpose of the assignment
  • Identify the effective date of the opinion
  • Identify the relevant characteristics of the property
  • Identify special assignment conditions (Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions)
The bolded bullet-point is further discussed:
Many types of value may be estimated in appraisals such as market value, investment value, use value, or assessed value. Each of these types of value has a separate definition, and special techniques may be required to estimate the particular type of value sought. Therefore, it is essential to specify the type of value being reported. If developing an opinion of market value is the purpose of an appraisal assignment, the clients or courts may request that the appraiser use a specific legal or economic definition of market value. The Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice require an appraiser to identify the type of value being estimated and provide a definition.
Once the type of value to be estimated has been identified, the appraiser can select the most appropriate valuation techniques and determine the data to be collected. Including the definition of value in the report also communicates the objective of the appraisal to the intended user of the report.
Appraising Residential Properties, AI, p. 70)(my bold)

J Grant, you continue to say that you do the cost approach but it does not represent market value.
According to recognized valuation practice and procedure, you cannot do an appraisal and select the appropriate techniques without first identifying what type of value you are trying to determine. Without identifying the purpose in step one, any technique you use may or may not be appropriate; and if it is, it is appropriate due to coincidence and not design.

SR1-1(a) is very clear: "be aware of, understand, and correctly employ those recognized methods and techniques that are necessary to produce a credible appraisal"

In multiple cases, I (and others) have posted what the recognized methods and techniques are and have cited the source. Yet you continue to hold on to the position that when you do the cost approach, it is not an indication of market value; that when you do it in your appraisals (which the purpose, in the case of GSE SOW-driven assignments, is to determine market VAlue) the process you use is not a cost approach indication of market value but an indication of something else.
You are going into the assignment with the intent of completing the cost approach not to determine market value, but to determine something else (I still don't understand what that something else is, but it doesn't matter; whatever it is, you state clearly that it is not market value).
You are seriously mistaken and I advise anyone who thinks you are correct to reconsider their position.

If you want to argue that the cost approach is not meaningful in many residential assignments, you'll win that argument (at least with me and certainly in the majority of my markets).
If you want to argue that it is sometimes difficult to accurately measure all forms of depreciation, you'll get many to agree with you (including me).
If you want to argue that when you do the cost approach, you don't consider it reliable and therefore don't give it much (if any) consideration in your final opinion-conclusion, that is an argument you should be making in your reconciliation statement in the report
After the appraisal has been reviewed and the appropriateness of the value opinions derived in the various approaches has been determined, differences in the value opinions must be reconciled. There is no simple arithmetical or statistical procedure for reconciling value opinions. Rather, appraisers reach a final value conclusion or a range of conclusions by assessing their confidence in each estimate. The degree of confidence associated with a given opinion usually depends on the appropriateness of the valuation approach to the problem at hand and the quality and quantity of the data used.

Again, the appraiser is not relieved of the obligation of employing the correct techniques in an approach to value; agreeing or disagreeing with how it works and why is not an option. If the appraiser does not understand and correctly employ those techniques, the appraiser must not accept an assignment where those techniques are a requirement.

The appraiser is 100% responsible for reconciling the value indications in his/her final opinion of value. It is in the reconciliation that the appraiser weighs the pluses and minuses of each approach against the quality of the data and the usefulness of the approach to mimic the market. It is in the reconciliation process that the appraiser can give zero consideration to the cost approach if he/she believes that the quality of the data is poor and another approach is more appropriate (due to appropriateness and quality of data).

But what is not acceptable is to complete the analysis incorrectly and then say, "I'm not considering it because the way I did it, it doesn't provide an indication of market value; it is something else."
 
Gawd dangitt! How do you always manage to type so much?
 
Gawd dangitt! How do you always manage to type so much?

Because I haven't learned to cut to the chase like you do! :laugh:

(but I'm working on it; I don't get as many "10,000 characters exceeded" errors as I used to for my posts!)
 
Gawd dangitt! How do you always manage to type so much?

Sad to say that Denis' Herculean effort at explanation will most probably fall on deaf ears! But then again, what does he know!!!!
 
And I've pointed this out several times in several different threads, but it never gets addressed.

The idea that someone is completing an appraisal assignment and completing an approach to value within that assignment but doesn't complete that approach with the objective of concluding market value is a fundamental flaw in valuation practice.

As I've posted before (and will post again), there are 8-steps in the valuation process as taught by the recognized texts. Texts that are cited by numerous authorities (such as the Board of Equalization in their assessment handbook when discussing how to appraise real property).





The first step is "Identification of the Problem". Within that first step includes the following:
  • Identify client and intended users
  • Identify the intended use
  • Identify the purpose of the assignment
  • Identify the effective date of the opinion
  • Identify the relevant characteristics of the property
  • Identify special assignment conditions (Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions)
The bolded bullet-point is further discussed:
Appraising Residential Properties, AI, p. 70)(my bold)

J Grant, you continue to say that you do the cost approach but it does not represent market value.

It is not ME that says the CA does not represent MV, it is the fromat of the CA itsel. The final value line of the CA states INDICATED VALUE, not INDICATED MARKET VALUE, or OPINION OF MARKET VALUE.

According to recognized valuation practice and procedure, you cannot do an appraisal and select the appropriate techniques without first identifying what type of value you are trying to determine. Without identifying the purpose in step one, any technique you use may or may not be appropriate; and if it is, it is appropriate due to coincidence and not design.

I understand that, of course!! But, see my further argument below.

SR1-1(a) is very clear: "be aware of, understand, and correctly employ those recognized methods and techniques that are necessary to produce a credible appraisal"

In multiple cases, I (and others) have posted what the recognized methods and techniques are and have cited the source. Yet you continue to hold on to the position that when you do the cost approach, it is not an indication of market value; that when you do it in your appraisals (which the purpose, in the case of GSE SOW-driven assignments, is to determine market VAlue) the process you use is not a cost approach indication of market value but an indication of something else.

Denis, the value "I" develop from the CA is done the same way as the value you develop...we follow the steps and arrive at an indicated value of the cost approach , which is not an opinion of market value till you say it is in your appraisal (after the reconciliation), and not an opinion of market value in my appraisal till I say it is (after the reconciliation.)

Like it or not, we are following the same steps, only you are calling the value developed from the CA market value prematurely, before the reconciliaiton.

The value value line after each approach says INDICATED VALUE. It does not say INDICATED MARKET VALUE . (yes I understrand if I am doing a MV purpose appraisal that is the SOW, but it STILL does not make the indicated value MV, till after the reconciliation)

The 3 approaches yield values that the appraiser can rely on to form an opinon of market value, but the approaches do not yield MARKET VALUE (until the appraiser says they do, after the reconciliation...but what is more correct is that the 3 approaches support the appraisers OPINION of MV, or the appraiser's OPINION of LV, or whatever the type of value the SOW and purpose of report is)

That is the difference I am trying to describe.

Of course, I recognize the purpose of the appraisal is to develop MV, and with that in mind, I choose certain data, or apply certain standards when choosing the data ( we might apply different standards for collecting data for LV, for example.). So the first part of your post was already what I am doing...I understand the purpose of the appraisal is to develop an opinion of MV, and the three approaches are a means to do that.

However, each approach in and of itself does not deliver MV (or LV, or any other type of value). It yields an indicated value, developed from the market of course, but it still is not YET an opinion of MV, untill we analyze the value and conclude that it is a credible and supported market value, (or liquidation value or whatever value we are trying to derive from the market).

You are going into the assignment with the intent of completing the cost approach not to determine market value, but to determine something else (I still don't understand what that something else is, but it doesn't matter; whatever it is, you state clearly that it is not market value).
You are seriously mistaken and I advise anyone who thinks you are correct to reconsider their position.

If you want to argue that the cost approach is not meaningful in many residential assignments, you'll win that argument (at least with me and certainly in the majority of my markets).
If you want to argue that it is sometimes difficult to accurately measure all forms of depreciation, you'll get many to agree with you (including me).
If you want to argue that when you do the cost approach, you don't consider it reliable and therefore don't give it much (if any) consideration in your final opinion-conclusion, that is an argument you should be making in your reconciliation statement in the report


Again, the appraiser is not relieved of the obligation of employing the correct techniques in an approach to value; agreeing or disagreeing with how it works and why is not an option. If the appraiser does not understand and correctly employ those techniques, the appraiser must not accept an assignment where those techniques are a requirement.

The appraiser is 100% responsible for reconciling the value indications in his/her final opinion of value. It is in the reconciliation that the appraiser weighs the pluses and minuses of each approach against the quality of the data and the usefulness of the approach to mimic the market. It is in the reconciliation process that the appraiser can give zero consideration to the cost approach if he/she believes that the quality of the data is poor and another approach is more appropriate (due to appropriateness and quality of data).

But what is not acceptable is to complete the analysis incorrectly and then say, "I'm not considering it because the way I did it, it doesn't provide an indication of market value; it is something else."

see above comments
 
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