UAD Quality Rating and Historic Home

[Pam Wyant]

They're looking for patterns of inconsistency. Not one off differences of opinion.

Not from what I read. If our opinion on quality or condition is different from the majority of other area appraisers, my understanding is that it will be flagged.

 

[J Grant]

It's not just about differing opinions of comparing other data. Some opinions simply don't make a lot of sense, or perhaps its better to say that they don't align with facts. In other words, if an appraiser sends in a report with a Q2 rating for a historic home, yet the photos show a cheap dated kitchen and baths, the opinion of Q2 and the facts of the property do not align. Some can argue that a C3 opinion also does not align, but actualy, it would, because Fannies' C or Q ratings are supposed to be holistic and address the main overall property , which includes major components when the rating is questionable.

 

[J Grant]

CORRECT, it will get flagged, could get ugly sometimes....an appraiser would have to defend why their opinion was what it is (or change it if they revisit the issue)

 

[Pam Wyant]

Pam...I think you may be out of touch for what a Q2 house is. I recently appraised a property at 4.8 million, with 1.5 being land. That was Q2

Definition of Q2: Custom-designed for an individual owner's site or high-end tract development; detailed high quality ornamentation, high-quality refinements and details. Sounds like it could fit to me.

Sounds like your home was likely Q1 unless you are in a really ritzy area. Q1 - The dwelling is a unique structure individually designed by an architect; a high level of workmanship and high-grade materials are evident throughout the interior and exterior.

Not sure that I am the one out of touch. The Q ratings don't really address age of the home. Neither do they state that granite countertops or even modern plumbing are a necessary component. I think one would be hard-pressed to call a good quality older home Q4 or Q5, but I guess we are all entitled to our opinions.

As I stated earlier, the most important thing would be making sure that comparables were similarly addressed.

 

[residentialguy]

Definition of Q2: Custom-designed for an individual owner's site or high-end tract development; detailed high quality ornamentation, high-quality refinements and details. Sounds like it could fit to me.

Sounds like your home was likely Q1 unless you are in a really ritzy area.

You're making a common mistake by using the neighborhood as a guide. It's not. Q1 is exceptional - and that is a nation scale, not for the market or even the state. Unless you're pushing nearly 8 digits with low land value, it's probably not a Q1. Most appraisers have never appraised one.

Meta gave a great analogy of the Q ratings
Q1= "Is there's a bigger, better, or more expensive material I can get in place of this one here? Seriously, I've got a lot of coin and I can send my jet to Japan for a toilet seat if that's what it takes. Are you sure we can't resurrect this Frank Lloyd guy...his stuff is the shizzle." You're hiring 1%'er craftsman from around the country, at least, to do a lot of the specialty work. If you can see drywall somewhere a mistake has been made.

Q2= "I've got more money than sense, but just barely." Nothing you can touch in a C2 home can be sourced at a home depot and the guys standing around the front looking for work don't have the skills to execute many of the construction methods and materials being used.

Q3=Really nice residential construction. Fundamentally, the materials and methods are no different from a tract home. There's a little more effort on design. Materials can be mostly be sourced locally, maybe not from home depot, but from from a nice specialty store in the next big city over is no problem. The home depot crew can do most of the work as long as they've got competent supervision.

 

[Pam Wyant]

You're making a common mistake by using the neighborhood as a guide. It's not. Q1 is exceptional - and that is a nation scale, not for the market or even the state. Unless you're appraising a 5 million property with low land value, it's not a Q1. Most appraisers have never appraised one.

Meta gave a great analogy of the Q ratings
Q1= "Is there's a bigger, better, or more expensive material I can get in place of this one here? Seriously, I've got a lot of coin and I can send my jet to Japan for a toilet seat if that's what it takes. Are you sure we can't resurrect this Frank Lloyd guy...his stuff is the shizzle." You're hiring 1%'er craftsman from around the country, at least, to do a lot of the specialty work. If you can see drywall somewhere a mistake has been made.

Q2= "I've got more money than sense, but just barely." Nothing you can touch in a C2 home can be sourced at a home depot and the guys standing around the front looking for work don't have the skills to execute many of the construction methods and materials being used.

Q3=Really nice residential construction. Fundamentally, the materials and methods are no different from a tract home. There's a little more effort on design. Materials can be mostly be sourced locally, maybe not from home depot, but from from a nice specialty store in the next big city over is no problem. The home depot crew can do most of the work as long as they've got competent supervision.

I don't anticipate ever doing a Q1 property, and not a lot of Q2s, but there are a few around. The way I read it, the quality is more about the architecture of the property than whether the toilet seat is gold plated and imported from some other country. Perhaps this is a downfall of Fannie Mae's definitions of the ratings. The last I checked we were supposed to be following those definitions rather those you personally made up.

 

[residentialguy]

Q1 properties are "unique structures that are individually designed by an architect for a specified user....constructed from detailed architectural plans and specifications and feature an exceptionally high level of workmanship and exceptionally high-grade materials throughout the interior and exterior of the structure"

That is your imported toilet home where everything is architecturally custom designed. These are exceptions...unusually rare to find.

Q2 - "The design features detailed, high quality exterior ornamentation, high-quality interior refinements, and detail. The workmanship, materials, and finishes, throughout the dwelling are generally of high or very high quality." OP never indicated anything like this...and the baths and kitchen would surely match.

 

[Alpine]

Thus why it's ridiculous to fit all homes into 6 subjective categories. Personally, I'd kill for a "+/-" add-on to the UAD for both quality and condition, but this thread confirms to me that, at a minimum, the system should expand to include a specific vintage/historic category. I concur with Q3, or Q2 if the kitchen and baths were also vintage. I've yet to have a client challenge my "Q" category in a report, so it seems less crucial than comparing/adjusting respective finish quality among the comps.

Sadly (or fortunately, as the case may be in appraising), we don't have much high-quality vintage architecture or properties in my market. Ironically, what little there is tends to suffer from the same thing described above, viz. that the kitchen and baths are often generic 1950s-80s butt-uglies, while the rest of the house has old-growth vintage mouldings, etc. My pet peeve is white Formica Euro-cabs in historic/vintage homes. And of course, there was that woman who sold her vintage Victorian home, then filled her new doublewide with crystal chandeliers and Victorian motifs...

 

[JTip]

Horse hair plaster archways, ornamental cast iron radiators and butler closets do not make a Q1 or Q2.

200 year old hand cut log homes with professional rechinking or stained glass windows over the main entry door, not a Q1 or Q2.

We are in big CU trouble.....

 

[J Grant]

throughout the interior and exterior

The kicker is the language; THROUGHOUT the interior and exterior. Skipping the kitchen and baths does not meet the standard of Q2 THROUGHOUT the interior . Then it specified interior and exterior...so a plainer, avg construction exterior finished with detailed/costly interior does not meet that exterior and interior both be Q2 ( to qualify for the rating)