Evaluation Liability

[SpartanAG]

Maybe you should then read all the posts to the thread, as,

I'm not yet sufficiently old enough to keep repeating what I and others have said, every hour or two.

Work with me here Spartan, read the thread.

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Ms. Rhodes: I have been an active participant throughout this entire thread. The only reason I am posting is to try to mitigate the gross misinformation that is being posted. I get that you don't agree that appraiser can perform evaluations without violating some regulation which will land them in appraiser jail. However, I have actual real world experience dealing with this very topic from the appraisal side and lender side including dealing with the regulators.

No one is coming after appraisers for doing evaluations. The lenders or happy when an appraiser does an eval because the quality is higher than their in-house staff. The regulators don't give a crap who does the eval as long as it is in the file. The state boards don't care, because the lenders that order the evals aren't turning appraisers in. If they don't like the eval they just order an appraisal.

There really is no need to get so worked up over this. Evaluations have been getting done for decades. The users, providers and regulators are all happy. No one is getting fined or thrown in appraiser jail. So please stop with the Chicken Little routine.....the sky is not falling.

 

[Meandering]

So, how do you think an Evaluation can become an Appraisal?

An evaluation can not become an Appraisal, unless the IAEG is changed to call it an Appraisal.

An Appraisal can not become an evaluation until,
the USPAP is changed to eliminate evaluation as part of the definition of appraisal practice, and, provides a STATEMENT (since they retired all previous statements, this should be a no brainer) That says USPAP only applies to FRTs, or,

USPAP never applies to Evaluations made for lenders.

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[BRCJR]

delete

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

I asked you to read footnote 17, and you posted footnote 16.

It is posted... it says "see text" right at the bottom and shot me back to that section

 

[SpartanAG]

Please read your USPAP from the preamble, through the definitions, ethics, Competency, and the two reporting standards.

Therein, you will find your answers.

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I am familiar USPAP. I can find nothing in the document that states I am in violation of the standards if I provide my client with more information than their minimum requirements. Please cite it for me so I can annotate my copy of USPAP. I'm sure others will benefit from this bit of knowledge as well, since I assume most appraisers exceed their clients minimum requirements to one degree or another.

 

[SpartanAG]

USPAP never applies to Evaluations made for lenders.
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The Appraisal Foundation begs to differ. See attached.

 

[Meandering]

Ms. Rhodes: I have been an active participant throughout this entire thread. The only reason I am posting is to try to mitigate the gross misinformation that is being posted.

Copied and pasted regulations are misinformation in your book?
Hummm

I get that you don't agree that appraiser can perform evaluations without violating some regulation which will land them in appraiser jail. However, I have actual real world experience dealing with this very topic from the appraisal side and lender side including dealing with the regulators.

And WaMu had actual real world appraisers making up values too. So what?

Comment
This Standards Rule recognizes that the principle of change continues to affect the manner in which appraisers perform appraisal services. Changes and developments in the real estate field have a substantial impact on the appraisal profession.

So lets' see, WHEN was all this experience you speak of? The ASB just decided on what an Appraisal Report IS, by definition. Was your "experience" under some other USPAP that did not have the newest definition of what an Appraisal Report is???????

??????

????

No one is coming after appraisers for doing evaluations.

Yet!

Didn't the FDIC go after 10 year old appraisals when the market crashed? Didn't it take 9 years to implement the AMC final rule? The new USPAP is only, 1 year old, and you expect the entire regulatory system to jump within one year?
Earth to Spartan.

The lenders or happy when an appraiser does an eval because the quality is higher than their in-house staff.

I'm sure they are, when they can get the malleable and the lemmings to hang themselves out there for $100 appraisals that their E&O won't cover, and the lenders can point to the appraisers as the ones who violate USPAP. Lenders can't violate USPAP. And on the other hand, doesn't say much for the in-house staff, does it?

The regulators don't give a crap who does the eval as long as it is in the file. The state boards don't care, because the lenders that order the evals aren't turning appraisers in.

They never care until bunches of loans go belly up. Didn't we just live through this? Or is this profession so full of old people they can't remember 7 years ago, 6 years ago, 5 years ago? Shall we pull up the headline news about, when regulators did give a crap what was in loan files?

If they don't like the eval they just order an appraisal.

Then why short change anyone and just order an appraisal to begin with? Oh I remember, because there is risk tied to an appraisal, that isn't tied to an eval, and that's why E&O companies don't want to cover them. Nope, it's forbidden to order a better quality product that might cost a little more, until the cheap product turns out to be crap, then it's okay to pay for TWO products. Yeah, I get it.

There really is no need to get so worked up over this. Evaluations have been getting done for decades. The users, providers and regulators are all happy. No one is getting fined or thrown in appraiser jail. So please stop with the Chicken Little routine.....the sky is not falling.

I did not claim the sky is falling anywhere. I claimed there was BS being thrown around and needed to be addressed. If you're of the opinion that it's okay to feed the lemmings BS so long as they do cheap work that is good for you, then we disagree, and will always disagree.

Now I would also address professionalism. The adaptation of USPAP into FIRREA was because a whole bunch of non-appraisers were producing value reports in any old haphazard method, and subsequently the S&L industry collapsed.

If the Ivory tower insists on a return to those practices, then I suggest, as professionals, that care about their profession, someone needs to address, the circle of history.

Let's get some understanding. Every "new" and exciting release of previous banking regulations, caveats to maintain "save and sound" banking.

And where pray tell, can we find the "save and sound" banking in the release of banking regulations?

The GAO did not find it, in either of their two studies.

You have data to support deregulation provides for "save and sound" banking?

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[Pittsburgh Pete]

So do copied and pasted regulations (out of text for the most part) pass as an argument for some?

 

[Meandering]

The Appraisal Foundation begs to differ. See attached.

Smoke and Mirrors baby.

As already discussed and stated multiple times, Appraisers are not sanctioned for violations of guidance, they are sanctioned for violation of the components of USPAP which USPAP states are the components of USPAP and are not necessarily all items packaged in the same book.

You have to go all the way back to USPAP 2008 to come up with this:


STATEMENT 10 (Retired): The Statement titled Assignments for Use by a Federally Insured Depository


Institution in a Federally Related Transaction was retired. Some of the issues addressed in STATEMENT 10

have been incorporated into the new Advisory Opinion 30, Appraisals for Use by a Federally Regulated


Financial Institution.

The Statement did not distinguish between laws (such as FIRREA), regulations and guidelines (such as


the Interagency Appraisal and Evaluation Guidelines) resulting in confusion for both appraisers and

users of appraisal services. The format and complexity of STATEMENT 10 were obstacles to its understanding and effective

enforcement. Substantial editing of STATEMENT 10 would not have resulted in increased understanding.


Ghee,
and all the other statements are retired in the current USPAP.


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[SpartanAG]

....You have data to support deregulation provides for "save and sound" banking?.

I'm sorry, but I'm having trouble following your incoherent and disjointed ramblings. Please try to calm down and present to cogent, well articulated response instead of a wall of copy/paste nonsense. The Appraisal Foundation, USPAP, IAEG and the regulators are all clear on the matter: Appraisers can perform evaluations for lenders.