Am I being trained properly?

[J Grant]

Perhaps look into if you can take any PAREA courses to supplement what you are being taught by mentor

 

[BRCJR]

Perhaps look into if you can take any PAREA courses to supplement what you are being taught by mentor

Where are those courses offered?

 

[J Grant]

Where are those courses offered?

To be honest I do not know, I believe they are available online, type it into search engine to find information on it , PAREA can also If I understand it correctly count for certain training hours

 

[BRCJR]

To be honest I do not know, I believe they are available online, type it into search engine to find information on it , PAREA can also If I understand it correctly count for certain training hours

Ok, I see now. You suggested someone looking for some professional advice do something that you don't know anything about.
Some people are genius......

 

[J Grant]

Ok, I see now. You suggested someone looking for some professional advice do something that you don't know anything about.
Some people are genius......

WTF is wrong with you?
Snark like this why people quit this board I will put you on ignore after this.
I know enough about PAREA to suggest the OP look into it, and since it is easily found online I told the OP they can find the information there.

 

[BRCJR]

WTF is wrong with you?
Snark like this why people quit this board I will put you on ignore after this.
I know enough about PAREA to suggest the OP look into it, and since it is easily found online I told the OP they can find the information there.

You do the very same (insult and snarky comments) to others. I just like to see if those that dish it out can take it.
I really don't care if you do ignore me.

 

[ramrcdk]

You do the very same (insult and snarky comments) to others. I just like to see if those that dish it out can take it.
I really don't care if you do ignore me.

Perhaps she has decided to IGNORE this Forum. In a busy day where JG provided the path,
I thought her Post was "fair" to ...search & Learn.

 

[Deleted member 157170]

This makes sense to me, especially after having been in the commercial arena. That was in a way more intuitive for me because the investors were generally concerned with a similar goal - maximizing return.

Residential is harder in that respect, for me at least. I know there is some art to it. What I am being taught right now is, say you have an outdoor feature like a screened-in lanai. Maybe a comp or two have similar lanais that are unscreened. If we think we know the contributory value of the screened-in lanai, any adjustment for there not being a screen is more of small walk-back from the full screened-in lanai (depending on size, condition, quality). I would admit trying to find paired sales on a minor deviation (like a screen v. no screen) is probably not something I would agonize over.

Very true, paired sales only get you so far, especially when sales are all over the place and don’t make sense. It’s possible the paired sales simply don’t exist in a way that would give you meaningful information. And the advanced valuation techniques are nice, and helpful, but they are also limited in their own way.

Residential appraisers are paid to know what buyers want in different areas and approximately how much they will pay for those features. Your mentor probably has a lot of experience understanding what features have value and which ones don’t. And that is fine, but it can get dangerous when someone has been appraising for years, using the same adjustments and not keeping an eye on market data.

I had a few mentors (I had 5 at the office I worked at for training). Some used the same adjustments they were using for over 10 years. When I would analyze market data and paired sales I noticed they would be way off. Others would periodically test their adjustments and keep up to date. Some had been appraising for 30 years and have never had a problem with not having backed up their opinions and are well known and respected in the area.

For example, I know in one neighborhood in Seattle a panoramic sound and Mountain View is adjusted at about 13.5 percent. another area has an 11 percent adjustment for busy road. Gated communities down south of Seattle have contributory value for the gated feature, 5 percent here, 7 percent there, etc. These adjustments change over time though with the fluctuations in the market and it’s all about keeping up and not getting lazy. Different appraisers also adjust differently based on their cumulative experiences in the market as well. There isn’t the one right and defensible way to go about adjustments, and if everyone adjusted differently but came to the same value conclusion, does it matter how they got there?

I think it’s best to think of it like this. Your buyers are not sophisticated. They think emotionally and will pay whatever they can afford, or think is fair. If you ask 5 different buyers what they think something is worth, they will all have radically different answers. They aren’t walking around a property with a clipboard marking off features or even doing simple math to try and figure out what they will pay between multiple properties based on the salient features. (Especially in this god awful supply shortage). So having a bit of that mentality in mind, while also having the data and technique to back your report up is what keeps residential appraisers thinking in terms of “market value”.

I think you can probably gain a lot of knowledge about the things that do and dont have value from your mentor, and then educate yourself on what you know you need to learn elsewhere. Then when you are certified and are on your own you will likely feel a lot more secure.

 

[PrincessLeia]

I have been a trainee appraiser working towards Certified Residential for roughly 6 months; my QE is done, and I am fully focused on getting as many experience hours as I can over the coming months. I come to the industry with 20+ years commercial real estate experience, with 4 of those years working under an MAI on in-house valuations and ad valorem tax appeals. I enjoy valuation work.

I was lucky to find a supervisor because a personal friend is Certified Residential and offered to take me on at my request. I am his first trainee. After a number of months of his supervision, I am beginning to question whether I am being trained properly on certain aspects. I'm concerned that I am not learning some of the more, in particular, technical/real life methods properly, but I would appreciate insight from others.

Most concerning to me is that I am not being taught how to properly support adjustments for the sales comparison approach. I have other similar, but more minor concerns that I will not get into at the moment. I have tried to inquire with my supervisor about how to use paired sales and any other techniques (looking beyond the overly simplistic textbook cases) to support adjustments. Instead, I am being taught what his short-hand heuristic approaches are (i.e. adjust X% of cost, flat dollar amounts for various physical features, etc.) that don't deviate much by neighborhood/price point nor are they backed up with much, if anything in the workfile. I have tried to incorporate data analysis with the use of third party adjustment software, but he is distrustful and regularly dismisses the data.

I don't believe he is deliberately cutting corners or trying to do anything intentionally misleading. Rather, the reports go above and beyond in other areas (photos, attachments, descriptions). We review the reports carefully before sending to clients (aside from what I've mentioned). Ultimately though the data/support/application of appraisal methods feels very insufficient and really risky should anything ever be challenged. My gut tells me this isn't ideal, and puts me in a vulnerable position once I am on my own because I've simply learned short-hands.

I'll add that I am grateful for my supervisor taking me on and giving me the opportunity. It has come at a cost to him. Maybe there are re-assuring words from this forum that what I've described is in some part normal in a world where appraisers have to work faster to earn a living? Or, if this is indeed something I should be concerned with, how do I get what I need? Going out and finding another supervisor would be a huge challenge, and I fear it would hurt him personally. I appreciate whatever insight this forum may have.

I feel you 1000%. NONE of my mentors ACTUALLY supported their adjustments. Like noodles, they threw numbers into the appraisal to see if they would stick. When I'd ask honestly "how do you know it's X for a [garage, bath, etc]" They would get combative and say... BECAUSE I JUST KNOW! In other words... they don't really know and had zero idea how to actually support their adjustments.

I highly recommend taking a course from the Appraisal Institute on Supporting your Adjustments.

But HONESTLY... The hands-down, BEST game changer for me was a webinar hosted by Josh Wallit & Dustin Harris (theappraisercoach).

Seriously... this was a GAME CHANGER for me. Anyone who says regression doesn't work or can't work because of a small market, I'm sorry... they're full of it. I live in a town of 33,000 people. seriously. And I use regression on almost every appraisal. This won't count for QE or CE, but it was honestly the best penny I spent in appraising.

Regression Basics – Both Parts | The Appraiser Coach

theappraisercoach.com

Once you do this a few 100 times, you'll start to get a really good feel for what buyers are really paying for which items. When I can't support using regression, I default to a depreciated cost modified by a "sensitivity analysis." I get the Cost & Depreciation from the Marshall & Swift Residential Cost Handbook. It's about $349/year. IT'S WORTH IT! It's far cheaper than paying $16-$20/appraisal through total. And by using the actual handbook, you get a really good feel for costs and how the system actually works. (If your mentor isn't doing the cost approach... they probably should be. None of my mentors did that either. They just said... it's not applicable for homes over X years. But again, that's just lazy B.S. I've gotten the cost approach to come in perfectly (within $3000 of my sales comparison approach) even on a 100+ year old house. This explains how to get a copy https://www.corelogic.com/downloada...hall-swift-residential-cost-handbook_scrn.pdf

Here's also a great article from OREP about proving your adjustments with great examples!

Proving Appraisal Adjustments

When I began appraising, I asked my mentor what adjustments to use- he said, "Figure it out for yourself." So I did. Here's what I learned.

www.workingre.com

Lastly, keep in mind... You have every right as a trainee to ASK how they support their adjustments. A lot of old timers don't support them though and asking them usually makes them irate because they know you're catching them out.

A mentor wants you to fill out the appraisal they way THEY do, they don't want you doing things like regression, etc. I got yelled at so many times by so many mentors for even proving adjustments using a matched pairs sales technique. With regression, my mentors just didnt' understand it.

So keep in mind, it gets to a point where yes, you are lucky to get your hours. And yes, we SHOULD be backing our adjustments. But if your mentor will not allow you to back your adjustments using a provable methodology.... do it anyway, keep it in YOUR workfile for that property. That way, if the state ever asks, and they want evidence, you can prove you DID the work and your supervisor required you to change it.

I know of at least one person in my state who trained his son SO POORLY, BOTH appraisers were pulled in front of the state board and had to take remedial education because the appraisal was crap. I honestly doubt that would ever happen, but if it did, you could PROVE you supported the data but your figures were ultimately changed by your mentor.

I hope this helps!

 

[TC]

Ok, I see now. You suggested someone looking for some professional advice do something that you don't know anything about.
Some people are genius......

Lighten up, Francis.