Realtor handed me 14 comps.

[shrubberyvaluation]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2026044231056252953

Don't recall people caring about ICE or the kids in cages when Obama was president. It is almost like they are just trying to virtue signal, without any virtue.

 

[RCA]

Imo , it is a mistake to refuse their "comps' when offered. They can use that against you, and it invites more ROV.

I assume the sales a RE agent gives are cherry-picked to hit a number and that most will be lousy, but once in a while, they provide a usable one. The point is that the appraiser accepting their offered sales is part of the expectation, so I accept them with a polite smile, then say, "I always do my own research; however, additional data is always welcome, thanks," and walk away to prevent further discussion. The same applies when a homeowner gives me sales in a refinance situation.

I do not argue with agents or owners or offer false hope that I am going to use their sales. When I was a newbie, I used to try to educate them about what sales were good and which ones were not - now I don't bother. Most agents present laughingly terrible sales, which can indicate why buyers overpay. Agents can provide useful market-area info or whether they have been inside a comp.

It is good practice to include a comment in every appraisal that "additional sales and listings were reviewed and considered." No need to specifically mention the agent's sales imo unless an appraiser feels a need for it.

This is absolutely terrible advice.

If the comps you are given by a biased sales agent are good, they will already show up in your collection. So, there should be nothing to refuse - unless the sales agents' comps are biased or erroneous, which they may very well be.

The appraiser chooses his own comps - unless he is in an area where the MLS is deficient, and comps are hard to come by. Then, in such cases, of course, you accept whatever "tips" you can get. and then verify everything.

I can usually get 100+ comps in the SF Bay Area, though I may need to cover the whole city or even go further (for special property types). I may also go back 5-10 years and let MARS objectively calculate adjustments for the date of sale.

But giving comps from an inherently biased sales agent special consideration violates USPAP.

 

[AppraisingLA123]

You can accept the agents comps and later not look at them, throw them away, take the comps, say thanks, why explain yourself to the agent? What I find more annoying then agents handing me always the wrong comps is when the owner sends me an an very overvalued appraisal. Am i supposed to disclose that the owner sent me a prior appraisal? i dont think so. The report is so bad, its written in all caps!

 

[Zoe]

On tidewater or in a next to non-existence ROV, VA requires the appraiser to address tidewater comps and ROV comps, but VA requires supporting reasoning and analysis in either case. VA does not require the appraiser to address a list of 14 comparables with no supporting reasoning or analysis. I tell the lender on an ROV or a tidewater initiative if they can send me 1-3 comps with reasoning and analysis, I will be more than happy to complete the appraisal or complete a revised appraisal report.

This is my tidewater notice and similar would apply to what is required for an ROV:

"Hi XXXX,

I am working on the above referenced appraisal. Based on preliminary analysis, I need to invoke the Tidewater initiative. Please be advised that the subject property will likely not meet the contract price. In accordance with VA Circular 26-03-11, you are hereby notified and requested to provide any additional information you would like to be considered in the appraisal of the subject property. Please supply any information you would like me to consider within 2 business days as well as a supporting summary and analysis of the information.

Please contact me with any questions you may have.

Sincerely,

XXXX"

Note most of the time, the lender is either going to go to agents or others involved in the transaction. If all they send me is 1 comparable with supporting summary and analysis of the information, I am happy.

If the lender don't send me any information, I move on. On tidewater, I complete the appraisal. On an ROV, I will do revised appraisal report and move on. Sometimes the subject winds up meeting the contract price on Tidewater. I don't do many ROVs but I would have no problem changing my original appraised value, if the ROV supported a change in appraised value. After years of working for VA, I may have done 1 or 2 ROVs.

Tidewater almost eliminates ROVs. Tidewater does not apply to refinances. You can't do Tidewater on refinances. The same appraisal procedures used on VA loans can be used on conventional, FHA etc.

I want to know what the agent used to help the seller base a list price and/or the buyer develop an offering price. I don't want a list of 14 comparables with no supporting summary of reasoning and analysis.

Agents know how to do a BPO. If they hand me a list of 14 comparables, it goes in my workfile. Many times agents will give you a list of bad comparables that just give more support for your final appraisal. The bias bleeds through the comparables they give you sometimes.

 

[RCA]

You can accept the agents comps and later not look at them, throw them away, take the comps, say thanks, why explain yourself to the agent? What I find more annoying then agents handing me always the wrong comps is when the owner sends me an an very overvalued appraisal. Am i supposed to disclose that the owner sent me a prior appraisal? i dont think so. The report is so bad, its written in all caps!

You can certainly "accept" comps, if by "accept" you mean nothing more than physically accept them. What you cannot do is give them special consideration - that implies bias.

 

[J Grant]

This is absolutely terrible advice.

If the comps you are given by a biased sales agent are good, they will already show up in your collection. So, there should be nothing to refuse - unless the sales agents' comps are biased or erroneous, which they may very well be.

The appraiser chooses his own comps - unless he is in an area where the MLS is deficient, and comps are hard to come by. Then, in such cases, of course, you accept whatever "tips" you can get. and then verify everything.

I can usually get 100+ comps in the SF Bay Area, though I may need to cover the whole city or even go further (for special property types). I may also go back 5-10 years and let MARS objectively calculate adjustments for the date of sale.

But giving comps from an inherently biased sales agent special consideration violates USPAP.

Who said anything about special consideration??

If anything, I give LESS consideration to the sales (not comps until I say so ) provided by a RE agent.

Taking sales from them is part of the game because if the appraiser refuses, it invites complaints and additional ROV. And on occasion,a RE agent does have a good sale to contribute that an appraiser might not have access to or has overlooked.

 

[RCA]

Who said anything about special consideration??

If anything, I give LESS consideration to the sales (not comps until I say so ) provided by a RE agent.

Taking sales from them is part of the game because if the appraiser refuses, it invites complaints and additional ROV. And on occasion,a RE agent does have a good sale to contribute that an appraiser might not have access to or has overlooked.

Ahhh, I keep forgetting - Most appraisers' appraisal methods are so ****ed up, e.g. they use Matched Pair Analysis, Linear Regression, and analyze as few comps as needed --- that, YES, clients have to stick a pocker up their butt from time to time.

 

[Zoe]

You can certainly "accept" comps, if by "accept" you mean nothing more than physically accept them. What you cannot do is give them special consideration - that implies bias.

On MV appraisal you have a good source for motivations. The market is not pure, but you can get atypical motivations in many appraisals.

Your little spreadsheet won't get atypical motivations in many many cases.

I'll give you examples. I was going bankrupt and needed to sell quick. I wanted house right next to my Mother and gave more because it was right next to my Mother.

I sold for this reason or this reason for motivation. I bought this house because I loved the design.

 

[J Grant]

Ahhh, I keep forgetting - Most appraisers' appraisal methods are so ****ed up, e.g. they use Matched Pair Analysis, Linear Regression, and analyze as few comps as needed --- that, YES, clients have to stick a pocker up their butt from time to time.

Unfortunately for you, the above methods are what is taught and is the methodology that has worked internationally and domestically extremely well for decades.

 

[Fernando]

Unfortunately for you, the above methods are what is taught and is the methodology that has worked internationally and domestically extremely well for decades.

That's the method my peers do and I accepted that.
RCA is a maverick. Good luck with that.
He should have been in academia.
I'd seen those types in universities.