Bad Mentors

[Kali Beck]

Why are there so many mentors out there that don't follow the proper appraisal techniques? Did they learn the same thing we newbies learned when going through the initial classes? What about market extraction for adjustments? I don't think a lot of mentors use it or even know how to use or better yet, even know about it. Is this a new concept or would they have been taught that 15-20 years ago? I am having to learn this on my own and it's very frustrating. Any advice on setting up a grid (do you write it down on paper or put it in a database on the computer), and advice on extracting would be VERY much appreciated!!!

 

[Jungle Boy]

Maybe the amount of variables has something to do with it?

 

[Mike Garrett RAA]

Sort of reminds me of when I was a kid....I thought my parents were old fashioned, stupid, and knew very little about life. Funny how as I grew older .... they got smarter and smarter.

 

[Dee Dee]

Kali,

Do you have a mentor now?

It saddens me to see what today's trainees have to go through, and it just keeps getting worse. Initial classes are completely inadequate to properly prepare them for the real job, and having a mentor to direct them simply isn't enough because they absolutely MUST keep up on current issues, technology, guidelines and USPAP in order to determine if their mentor is training them properly. Most trainees are clueless if they're being told all the wrong things, and even if they know this is the case they are reluctant to walk away from the dwindling number of jobs available.

If I understand your questions correctly, the answer is that hand-writing grids and making adjustments is beyond obsolete. Modern appraisers have software that is specific to the appraisal field.

Market adjustments are derived from sales in any given market area, and can be different from one neighborhood to the next. This is why market familiarity and competance is so important. Unfortunately, many appraisers consistantly use the same dollar amount adjustments for room counts, condition, views, square footage....because they're too damned lazy to figure out if it's truly accurate for each area. You're a pretty sharp trainee if you've already picked up on this discrepency....many never do.

Hope that helps.

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

What I do on a regular basis is put at least 9 (sometimes 12) comps up on the grid in one report. I then play around with the adjustements, (this is a paired sales analysis), until I get the bottom lines to come as close as possible. I ususally keep the GLA SF adjustment for last. Many times during this process I'll end up printing all the grid pages so I can look at all of them lined up next to each other and check to make sure all comps received the same across the board adjustments with the correct + or - sign. This type of analysis will give you the approximate adjustment for a fireplace, a 2 car garage vs 1 car, pool vs no pool, screen enclosed pool vs open pool, etc. in the 25 yr old subdivision of $100,000 homes as long as those are the comps you are using. It will be very different in the 5 yr old project of $350,000 homes. Somewhat similar projects but in different areas of your city or county can also be different. Each sub-market will end up with different adjustments for the different components.

Why are there so many mentors out there that don't follow the proper appraisal techniques? Did they learn the same thing we newbies learned when going through the initial classes? What about market extraction for adjustments? I don't think a lot of mentors use it or even know how to use or better yet, even know about it. Is this a new concept or would they have been taught that 15-20 years ago?

There seems to be very few appraisers, both with many years of appraising experience and those with just a couple of years, that really care about doing the job correctly. They all were taught the correct methods at some point. Unfortunately, too many think they don't have to pay any attention to that, and too many have been getting away with it for too many years now.

The unethical short cutters have been multiplying like rabbits and we now have too many generations of them continuing to train the next batches. It's not very profitable to take on trainees when you actually take the time and effort to correctly train them, so many of the really good appraisers just don't. Again, unfortunately, this leaves the ethically challenged taking all the trainees they can get and pumping out the fraud and/or simply incompentent appraisals and reports. Some, if not many, of these supervisors actually don't even know how damn dumb they really are!

Frustrated and trying to make it better.

 

[Kali Beck]

Dee Dee, I do have an appraiser now, but she doesn't extract adjustments from the market but uses more of a cost of that feature approach. Which from what I understand is not right. So I am trying to teach myself how the extract it from the market. I agree w/ you that it is very difficult for the trainee who wants to do appraisals the way they are supposed to be done, but are forced to lag behind a mentor who doesn't do it that way. And by specific appraisal software do you mean Wintotal or something like that? That's what I use...but what do I need to use to apply paired sales analysis. Is there a program for that?

Mike, I am sorry, but I don't agree w/ your statement in my instance. I am able to acknowledge what he does know & I try to capitalize on that, but there are other areas where I am teaching him...and that is very irritating & frustrating.

Pam, thanks for the help on the grid...are you doing this on the URAR form in the Sales Comp area or just on a piece of paper? I am thinking I need to set up a grid w/ all adjustment variables in something like Lotus, then fill it out whenever I find Comps to use to extract the adjustments from for a particular neighborhood. Am I making any sense?

By the way...this is a great web site...I love all this help everyone gives!! :lol:

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

I have Alamode WinTotal and do this on the URAR grids.

We will help you all we can. Just make sure you take your name back off from any appraisals your supervisor changes if you don't agree with those changes.

You have something very good and special going for you..... you actually recognize that you're not being tained properly!!!

 

[Mike Garrett RAA]

Kali....I will agree with you one this...most appraisers don't do pairs analysis on every appraisal to make the adjustments. First of all, if we did that, we would have to charge $1,000 per appraisal. Secondly, after you have done more than 9,000 appraisals I will give you the right to tell me my adjustments are not correct. You see, we development adjustments based on the market and those files are maintained in two places... our appraisal files and our mental file. This is one of the very good reasons to have a requirement that the mentor be certified with a minimum of five (5) years of experience. I personally know of appraisers with less than two years total experience attempting to mentor as many as 6 other appraisers. Dumb, huh?

In the beginning you should do pairs analysis to determine those adjustments. You could also trust your mentor to have the knowledge to make those adjustment too. This is not rocket science, it's an art. I instruct the registered appraisers 75 hour pre-license course here in Colorado Springs. In every class I have students asking me for the "magic adjustment" list. There is no such thing.

Do yourself a favor and develop the concept of percentage of contribution for adjustments. As an example, what is the adjustment for a two car vs three car garage? Would it be the same in, say, a $150,000 house as compared to a $350,000 house? If that percentage works out in your market to be, say, 2% then the adjustment in the $150,000 range would be $3,000 and in the $350,000 range it would be $7,000. This could be what your mentor is mentally doing when she reviews your work.

In any event, keep asking your questions. Be open to suggestions and learn the skills associated with this business. I wish you well.

 

[graindart]

Or it could be that a mentor doesn't know what they're doing..........or hasn't followed newer developements and processes.........or just was never taught correctly........or........

I've run across several appraisal reports over the past couple of years that have been done by some of the old dogs that clearly show that they don't have a clue (in my opinion). Of course I'm not saying that the majority of the more experienced appraisers complete this quality of work. However, there are a percentage of appraisers that became licensed / ceritified in the early 90's with relatively little experience and / or education. They're grand-fathered in to any new requirements, and just have to sit through a few CE classes every couple of years. It's pretty simple once you've already got the license. I'd wager that quite a large percentage of the newer licensed / certified appraisers (past couple years) have more head knowledge than a relatively large percentage of the more experienced appraisers who were licensed in the early 90's. There are quite a few older appraisers around here (Montana) that I'm pretty sure wouldn't even be able to pass the new licensing exams for the licensure level that they are currently at. Yes, I know that head knowledge doesn't always translate into good appraisals, but without having the knowlege at all, there is no way to implement the ideas / processes.

Even if the mentor is a competent appraiser and has continued to learn and adjust to the ever changing world of RE appraising, it doesn't mean that he / she would be a competent teacher. I really don't enjoy government policing, so it pains me to say this, but I believe that there should be both a "trainee" designation along with a "trainer" designation. I don't know what the requirements for being a "trainer" should be, but I think a good start would be that the "trainer" would at least have to pass the current licensing exam once every couple of years. I realize that this would put even more obstacles in the way of the licensing process, but maybe it would cut down on some of the unqualified mentors or at least cause them to study up on the newer processes. Before any trainees / potential trainees start complaining about the process already being hard enough, how would you like to finally find your mentor and after "learning" from him / her for a couple of years, find out that you've learned wrong from someone that probably couldn't even qualify to get a license himself / herself at today's standards? Of course, I don't know of any real way to guarantee a "trainer" is actually qualified, because one can have the experience, education, knowledge, etc and still not be able to communicate it properly to a pupil.

 

[Mike Simpson]

I was fortunate enough to have employers who cared about training me first--believing I'd make a better appraiser & employee later. I performed countless paired sales analyses, talked to buyers, sellers, builder & developers and/or Realtors when available & really received a first class education from some very well respected appraiser's.

Additionally, I've an extensive background in construction (including estimation), I'm a former home inspector/commercial pest control consultant, certified appraiser, and associate broker. With this kind of experience I don't feel the need to arise from my chair & reach for my copy of Marshall & Swift (Residential Cost Handbook) everytime I perform a cost approach. Likewise I don't feel the need to form a paired sales analysis to make a pool adjustment. Depending on the component I will conduct research in an attempt to form a paired sales analysis, however, an accumulation of experience, education & having ones finger on the pulse of the marketplace is invaluable & quite often immeasurable.

-Mike