Correct way to log experience hours?

[gsdub19]

I was wondering if anyone here could help me out. I've been in real estate for the past few years and I am considering entering the appraisal industry. A good friend of mine who's an AL for 20+ years already said he would train me if I wanted to do it. My question is in regards to the 2000 hrs experience required to be an AL in California. So I spoke to two different staff appraisers from the OREA on two separate occasions and both gave me different answers:

The first staff appraiser said I would need to take courses, pass a test, and then get my AT license which would allow me to assist on reports. The way that I would credit or hours toward my experience log is by doing at least 75% of the work (with your mentor's supervision), then signing the report (on the left side), and my supervisor signing the right side.

The second staff appraiser said that getting your AT license first is a misconception. He said you don't need an AT license to start assisting with reports and getting hours. He said you can start getting your hours by doing at least 75% of the work (with your mentor's supervision of course) then detailing your duties in a small paragraph on the text addenda of your report. Then when you're close to your 2000 hrs, you can take the required courses for your AT, pass the test, and then apply for the AL state exam.

Obviously these are two very different ways to attain your hrs. Which one do you think is right? And regarding both methods, how would I go about getting hrs if AMC's from my understanding will not allow anyone to sign or be mentioned on the report under then the head appraiser? Is non-AMC work (personals, estate work, tax reconsiderations, etc) the only way? My friend the AL has trained people in the past and they became licensed through him, but he's not sure now with all these new AMC's and regulations. Is there anyone here that is a AL or AR currently training people or perhaps a newly licensed AL that can shed some light? Preferably in Cali. I know the industry's not advisable to enter anymore but I figure if I have someone who's willing to train me and it probably will only take a year to get my 2000 hrs, then it might be worth doing. Thanks for your time.

 

[Mike Kennedy]

Question: What if lenders won't let me sign appraisals as a Trainee licensee although I have a co-signer who is certified at the appropriate level for the type of property being appraised and in good standing with OREA?

Answer: As a licensed Trainee appraiser, you may accumulate experience hours without signing the appraisal in the following ways:

1. By providing "significant professional assistance" to another appraiser and having the duties you performed identified in the report. If you perform at least 75% of the professional appraisal work and the appraisal conforms to the Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice (USPAP), this experience would qualify under Category 10 (Assistance in the Preparation of Appraisals) for up to a maximum of 400 hours of credit; and/or
2. By performing the entire appraisal process under the direct supervision of a California certified appraiser. The final conclusion as to value is made by and the appraisal is signed by the licensed appraiser, with you and the duties you performed identified in the report. If you perform all appraisal methods customarily used for a particular property type and the appraisal conforms to the USPAP, this experience would qualify under Category 1 (Fee and Staff Appraisal) with an unlimited number of hours.

Question: How can I gain acceptable experience as an unlicensed appraiser?
Answer: Acceptable experience may be accumulated as an unlicensed appraiser in any of the following ways:

1. By providing "significant professional assistance" to another appraiser and having the duties you performed identified in the report. If at least 75% of the professional appraisal work is performed by the unlicensed person and the appraisal conforms to the Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice (USPAP), this experience would qualify under Category 10 (Assistance in the Preparation of Appraisals) for up to a maximum of 400 hours of credit;
2. By performing the entire appraisal process under the direct supervision of a California certified appraiser. The final conclusion to value is made by and the appraisal is signed by the licensed appraiser, with you and the duties you performed identified in the report. If the unlicensed person performs all appraisal methods customarily used for a particular property type and the appraisal conforms to USPAP, this experience would qualify under Category 1 (Fee and Staff Appraisal) with an unlimited number of hours; and
3. By the unlicensed person completing appraisals him or herself in non-federally related transactions. In California, any appraisal completed for a federally related transaction requires a licensed appraiser. However, work performed for attorneys, private individuals, etc., are generally not federally related transactions and can be performed by anyone. If the appraisal conforms to USPAP, this experience would qualify under Category 1 (Fee and Staff Appraisal) with an unlimited number of hours.

http://www.orea.ca.gov/html/LicenseFaqs.shtml#q5

http://www.orea.ca.gov/html/LicenseFaqs.shtml

 

[So Cal RealEstate]

I was wondering if anyone here could help me out. I've been in real estate for the past few years and I am considering entering the appraisal industry. A good friend of mine who's an AL for 20+ years already said he would train me if I wanted to do it.

If I remember correctly your mentor has to be an AR...

 

[Randolph Kinney]

If I remember correctly your mentor has to be an AR...

Absolutely correct.

The OP needs to get a copy of the Real Property Appraiser Qualification Criteria manual : http://www.orea.ca.gov/pdf/AQB_Criteria_2011.pdf

 

[gsdub19]

Absolutely correct.

The OP needs to get a copy of the Real Property Appraiser Qualification Criteria manual :

My mistake. My friend is indeed an AR; I got confused.

Thanks for the input guys. However, I'm still a bit confused. I perused the FAQ on the OREA site as the well the AQB criteria manual.

I understand what qualifies as logged hours now...like the different categories...but I still can't figure out whether I have to get my AT license before I start assisting and logging my hours? Or can I just start assisting right away, bypass the AT step, and just do the coursework and get my hours?

It seems like the FAQ is implying that as long as there's a statement in the report explaining my duties, that would be adequate as counting towards my hours. The AQB criteria manual, however, has a experience log sample that frequently shows the head appraiser co-signing the report with the license applicant. So I'm still boggled...AT or not needed?...paragraph of duties performed or co-sign the report??

 

[Mike Kennedy]

My mistake. My friend is indeed an AR; I got confused.

Thanks for the input guys. However, I'm still a bit confused. I perused the FAQ on the OREA site as the well the AQB criteria manual.

I understand what qualifies as logged hours now...like the different categories...but I still can't figure out whether I have to get my AT license before I start assisting and logging my hours? Or can I just start assisting right away, bypass the AT step, and just do the coursework and get my hours?

It seems like the FAQ is implying that as long as there's a statement in the report explaining my duties, that would be adequate as counting towards my hours. The AQB criteria manual, however, has a experience log sample that frequently shows the head appraiser co-signing the report with the license applicant. So I'm still boggled...AT or not needed?...paragraph of duties performed or co-sign the report??

See the QAs posted above in Post #2.

 

[Randolph Kinney]

My mistake. My friend is indeed an AR; I got confused.

Thanks for the input guys. However, I'm still a bit confused. I perused the FAQ on the OREA site as the well the AQB criteria manual.

I understand what qualifies as logged hours now...like the different categories...but I still can't figure out whether I have to get my AT license before I start assisting and logging my hours? Or can I just start assisting right away, bypass the AT step, and just do the coursework and get my hours?

It seems like the FAQ is implying that as long as there's a statement in the report explaining my duties, that would be adequate as counting towards my hours. The AQB criteria manual, however, has a experience log sample that frequently shows the head appraiser co-signing the report with the license applicant. So I'm still boggled...AT or not needed?...paragraph of duties performed or co-sign the report??

My understanding is that you do not have to have a trainee license to assist in the appraisal and log experience hours. Once you have satisfied the prerequisites to apply for the AL license, you can apply for that license.

 

[Randolph Kinney]

From OREA

Question: How can I gain acceptable experience as an unlicensed appraiser?

Answer: Acceptable experience may be accumulated as an unlicensed appraiser in any of the following ways:

1. By providing "significant professional assistance" to another appraiser and having the duties you performed identified in the report. If at least 75% of the professional appraisal work is performed by the unlicensed person and the appraisal conforms to the Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice (USPAP), this experience would qualify under Category 10 (Assistance in the Preparation of Appraisals) for up to a maximum of 400 hours of credit;
   
2. By performing the entire appraisal process under the direct supervision of a California certified appraiser. The final conclusion to value is made by and the appraisal is signed by the licensed appraiser, with you and the duties you performed identified in the report. If the unlicensed person performs all appraisal methods customarily used for a particular property type and the appraisal conforms to USPAP, this experience would qualify under Category 1 (Fee and Staff Appraisal) with an unlimited number of hours; and
   
3. By the unlicensed person completing appraisals him or herself in non-federally related transactions. In California, any appraisal completed for a federally related transaction requires a licensed appraiser. However, work performed for attorneys, private individuals, etc., are generally not federally related transactions and can be performed by anyone. If the appraisal conforms to USPAP, this experience would qualify under Category 1 (Fee and Staff Appraisal) with an unlimited number of hours.

 

[pustyns]

Hi All,
I got my trainee license, but having a hard time finding AR to get my hours, is anyone need a trainee in Sacramento/Placer county? Please I have been in Real Estate business for over 6 years, Please let me know... email me sergey@neighborlyrealty.com
Thank you

 

[PrincessLeia]

Dear gsdub19,


I'm a "Trainee" without a trainee license. I started in a state (Hawaii) where they don't have the trainee level. When I moved to California, I called OREA to find out what to do. They said I could just continue working on my hours and jump straight to the AL or AR levels.

Getting your hours is easy... You just need a mentor. Making sure OREA gives you credit for those hours under the right category is a bit trickier because you can't sign the report if you don't have a Trainee license. Moreso, ALL the clients my mentor has will NOT accept work from Trainees...

That said, we've NEVER had a report rejected because I worked on it despite EVERY client saying on their order form that they will reject Trainee work. I think the clients dont notice that it's trainee work because I don't sign the reports, (although I ALWAYS make a comment in every report). Basically, signing a report as a trainee is like raising a big flag whereas making a comment in the addendum is much less obvious.

The rules are a little tricky on categories. So, this is what I say in EVERY report in the supplemental addendum. I combined key words from OREA's commentary on how to get credit for your hours. Yes, my paragraph is redundant but I didn't want to chance loosing hours by not being thorough. Hopefully, this helps you: (the blank underlines are spaces for my name or my mentor's name)


Assistance - Significant professional assistance was provided by _______________, whose contributions included performing the entire appraisal process under the direct supervision of ___________, a California Certified Residential Appraiser. Specific actions included preliminary research of public records for subject and comparable sales data with __________; comparable selection and revision after consult with supervising appraiser, assisting the principal appraiser in the exterior inspection of the subject property and comparables; taking photos of subject and comparables under direction of the principal appraiser; research of neighborhood market trends and completion of the 1004 MC form in accordance with appraisal principles and under supervision of principle appraiser, composition of the entirety of the appraisal under direct supervision of _______________ using all appraisal methods customarily used for this particular property type in accordance with USPAP, UAD and client requirements, using appraisal methods in the valuation process of final opinion of value and revising the report after final consultation with and under direct supervision of the supervising appraiser, _______________.


Good luck!!