UAD Basement and Basement Finish question

[Mutyger]

I was wondering if anyone else has problems with filling out the comparable square footage below grade and the square footage of finish in the comparable's lower level. I only have 2 counties that report the basement square footage and for the most part, other counties in the area don't have adequate building sketches on file to determine an actual square footage of the basement. I had 1 assessor recently tell me this: If its a ranch, go with the above grade square footage, a 2 story, divide the total reported GLA by 2 and so forth. Most modern construction in my area has garages built in to the first level and so if you are doing a 2 story home the 2nd level covers some or most of the garage level above grade so the 1st level is actually smaller than the 2nd floor. (Im sure this is common everywhere now a days). Even when you are looking at a ranch, the comparables GLA would include such things as bay windows or bump outs which do not extend into the basement. How do you all come up with an acurate basement square footage in these situations?

In addition, how in the world do you develop an accurate SF measurment for rooms below grade for the comparables? Some agents in my area just plainly state the rooms below grade without measuring them (our MLS system does not include any 1/2 baths or full baths in the agent calculation grid, ie rec room 19x30 when they display it for listing purposes). Some of the agents report a total living area, which always seems to magically be a round number, ie, this home has a total living are of 3700SF, when the above grade GLA is something like 2094 SF. And lastly, some agents state that there are rooms below grade and when I actually look at them for purchases the lower level has painted concrete walls and rolled carpeting (not permenantly installed) without a finished ceiling. I was one of those appraisers that prior to the UAD, I would put Full Basement and the next line I would put Part Finished (without describing the rooms below grade for the comparables)

Why would Fannie Mae or whomever want an exact SF of rooms below grade when I have not viewed the comparables interior or measured it professionally for that matter?

 

[Mr Rex]

Probably the best source of info is the RE agents. Call both Listing and Sales agent, compare notes with the assessor's data, ask questions of the agents if their info differs from the assessors etc. and report your sources. If you think about it, how much different is it than a RE agents representation of condition or quality? You use the best data available to you and disclose the source. What else can you do? Not calling when the data is a s bad as you say would not be considered your best effort if any questions arise later, IMHO.

 

[residentialguy]

Call the realtors and ask, but most don't measure it. You just have to go with common sense...you've been in most types before and have a decent idea. Sometimes the assessor figures will help. That was pretty good advice.

I put this in all my reports.

Information about basements is not readily available in the local MLS or public records. The appraiser has taken due diligence in obtaining as much information as possible in the normal course of business. This includes attempts in contacting listing agents, selling agents, buyers, sellers, or in some cases, attempting to contact the current occupants of the property. Unfortunately, the unfinished area is typically not measured by the agent or homeowner and not available through MLS or public records. The fact that the exact area of a basement is not measured by the agent or by the buyers is a strong indication that the exact square footage of the basement is not a customary determination of value for market participants. Therefore, the best information available is the appraiser's estimate of the basement area, based upon professional knowledge of similar model homes, and is considered an acceptable practice. Full basements are given same area as foundation size, however some variances are possible.

 

[Mutyger]

Most agents around here aren't very reliable. Until recently, before the regional MLS sent out a blast email to all subscibers, most agents were still marketing their properties with combining GLA and GBA and not seperating the 2 out. We have a few assessors that only provide the 1st floor GLA even if its a 2 story or 2.5 story home. Most agents will not measure the 2nd and 3rd floors and just market it with whatever the assessor says for 1st floor living area.

As far as the basement finish is concerned, Ive seen agents list properties as having finish in the basement but when I view them for purchases I see unfinished ceilings, rolled carpeting and painted concrete walls. I even had 1 where an owner threw down a throw rug and had tv and couch (no finish anywhere) and the agent said it was a "media area".

The point is, why does Fannie Mae require the finished square footage finish in the comparables basment? I can see listing the rooms out but why a measurement for a comparable basement that I have not viewed?

 

[Mike Kennedy]

Basement & Finished Rooms Below Grade Line 1 The appraiser must report:
 Total square footage of the property improvements below grade – If there is no basement, enter the numeral zero (0). No other information may be entered.
 Finished square footage of the property improvements below grade, if applicable. Do not indicate a percent finished.
 The type of access to the basement, if applicable. The allowable values are „Walk-out‟ (wo), „Walk-up‟ (wu), or „Interior only‟ (in), which must be abbreviated on the appraisal report form to fit in the available space.
In some jurisdictions, the total square footage of the property improvements below grade and/or the finished square footage of the property improvements below grade may not be available to the appraiser within the normal course of business. In such cases, an appraiser may report the estimated total square footage of the property improvements below grade and the finished area below grade for the comparable properties and disclose within the appraisal report that the size is an estimate and report the source and basis for the estimate.

Line 2 The appraiser must report the number of each type of finished rooms in the basement on Line 2 of this data field if the finished square footage of the basement is greater than zero. The room type descriptors are:
ABBREVIATED ENTRY ROOM TYPE
rr Recreation Room
br Bedroom
ba Bathroom
o Other
The appraiser must enter the numeral zero (0) if there are no rooms of a particular type. If the finished square footage of the basement is zero, no entries should be made for the basement room type counts.

Reporting Format: Line 1: Total Square Footage – Numeric to 5 digits, whole numbers only Line 1: Finished Square Footage – Numeric to 5 digits, whole numbers only Line 1: Basement Access – Appraiser must select one value from the specified list (values wo, wu, or in) The PDF creator will automatically insert the text „sf‟ to separate the data values. Line 2: Room Count/Type – Numeric to 1 digit* *For bathrooms, the format is n.n – full baths separated from half baths with a period (.). The PDF creator will automatically insert the room type abbreviations to separate the data values. Examples: Line 1: 1000sf750sfwu Line 2: 1rr1br1.0ba2o

UAD Appendix D: Field-Specific Standardization Requirements
Page 29 of 38 Document Version 1.4
Version Date: June 19, 2012

 

[Michigan CG]

Probably the best source of info is the RE agents. Call both Listing and Sales agent, compare notes with the assessor's data, ask questions of the agents if their info differs from the assessors etc. and report your sources. If you think about it, how much different is it than a RE agents representation of condition or quality? You use the best data available to you and disclose the source. What else can you do? Not calling when the data is a s bad as you say would not be considered your best effort if any questions arise later, IMHO.

I would add only one thing to this. When asking about finished basement area ask for the percentage, don't ask for SF. I ask the agents the following:

"Susie, the basement is 1,200 SF, what percentage of that was finished?"

"Susie, what rooms were in the basement?"

"Susie, was this basement professionally finished or was it two guys and a keg of beer?"

 

[residentialguy]

I ask the agents the following:

"Susie, the basement is 1,200 SF, what percentage of that was finished?"

"Susie, what rooms were in the basement?"

"Susie, was this basement professionally finished or was it two guys and a keg of beer?"

Do the guys get mad when you call them "Susie"?

 

[Riick]

Call the realtors and ask, but most don't measure it. You just have to go with common sense...you've been in most types before and have a decent idea. Sometimes the assessor figures will help. That was pretty good advice. .....

Thank you for your common sense answer; some people here get carried away with precise numbers and then produce an EMV, with digits like $188,647.55 Bogus.

 

[Doug DeMars]

FWIW...

As noted in the Fannie Mae Single Family / 2002 selling Guide / Part XI: Property and Appraisal Guidelines (06/30/02) / XI, Chapter 4: Reviewing the Appraisal Report (06/30/02) / XI, 405: Improvements Analysis (06/30/02) / XI, 405.06: Gross Living Area (06/30/02)

"...the appraiser should report the basement or other partially below-grade areas separately and make appropriate adjustments...in the "sales comparison analysis" grid....The appraiser may deviate from this approach if the style of the subject property or any of the comparables does not lend itself to such comparisons. However, in such instances, he or she must explain the reason for the deviation and clearly describe the comparisons that were made."

 

[Mike Garrett RAA]

Below grade is below grade...it's really stupid (in my opinion) to deviate from this. Lets all get on the same page and eliminate the confusion. First line of below grade adjust for size difference (SF). On line 2 adjust for the finished area (% finished).