Weak Floors

[Charlie]

Hello everyone.
Long time lurker who doesn't post very often here. Im still fairly new (licensed this year) and dont often find anything additional to add after the more experienced have spoken. In my area (Hampton Roads, Virginia) I am seeing lots of problems in the floors of the older (and some not so old) houses in the area. You know the signs, when you are doing the inspection the floor gives when you walk over it. Sometimes it just gives a bit and sometimes it feels like you may fall through into the crawl space. Im just trying to check and see how others handle this situation. I used to say, "The flooring in the **** area of the subject property appears weak. The cause of this is unknown and an inspection by a structural engineer is recommended if further clarification is desired." However, after having to listen to rants by upset loan officers and lenders about having to find a structural engineer I changed that term to structural expert in hopes that a home inspector could cover this. My question is- is this an appropriate comment when this situation is encountered and is there a better way of saying this that I might be able to steal . Also, when the area of the weak floor is very small (say 1' by 1') do you still point out this fact in your report (opinions wanted) or have i been nitpicking? Some of my clients seem to think that I am causing unnecessary problems but you know how that is. Thanks everyone for any input and for sharing the knowledge gained through your experience. It is appreciated by at least some of us newbies. Charlie Darling

 

[Mountain Man]

Do you see a problem with the subflooring in the basement or crawl? If it looks rotten, I'd definately mention it. If I do see a problem, I use something similar to what you use.

The flooring in the **** area of the subject property appears weak. The cause of this is unknown and an inspection by a structural engineer is recommended if further clarification is desired."

But as is common in "average" construction, they will lay subflooring, then padding and carpet. So yes, it's going to feel "squishy"...... Cheap construction. But if the market accepts it.....

 

[Charlie]

M Legget,
Thanks for your response. Usually when I encounter this i do not see rotten subflooring in the basement or crawl area. I just feel the weak area of the floor and call it. I dont get under the house and do an inspection of the subflooring. Should I be doing this if I feel a weak area? Personally, i dont get along with the snakes and spiders who tend to make these areas home in my region. But I will do it if I believe this would be the method my peers (fellow forumites) would take to get at the cause of the problem. Also, as to your other comment, I dont think the weak floor problems im referring to are due to "squishy" floors which are the the result of "average" construction. I only mention the problem when a certain area of the floor shows signs of weakness and I feel that it is due to rotten subfloor or some other problem. Thanks for the input.

 

[Kate]

You might be a bit nitpicky. But it's your opinion that matters. If you feel that it is way out of wack that you should mention it.
Personally, I grew up in a 200+ year old home. There was not a single level floor in that place but it was built to last. If you took a marble and placed it anywhere in the house it would roll for a good long time. They used much thicker beams and sills back then though, not the junk they use today to build. Have you seen the particle board crap they put up on the newest and "best" homes? Now I live in a 100 year old home. She is also built to last. Floors show some wiggle. It's called character!

 

[CANative]

My house was built in the 1870's and still going strong. So much for REL.

 

[Richard Carlsen]

Charlie

Stop hiding/lurking and share your knowledge with us. We need fresh input all of the time. Especially from newly licensed people.

Question: You say you are seeing lots of problems with floors on some older houses. Are these seen doing appraisals for sales? If so, I would think that the market is telling you that either squiggly floors or spongy floors are not inhibiting to normal marketability in these older houses. Therefore, what you see might be considered to be "average" for this age house. Think about your market data and if it shows that this fact is confirmed, then I would simply note the uneven floors or the "slight give in the flooring, typical of older homes in the market." Of course if it is really bad, then go right ahead and call for or recommend an inspection.

BTW, you go a bit further than I would in going into a crawl space to see if you can see the problem. The problem with that is that now you begin to play home inspector or contractor. Unless you are trained for it, you could look right at a problem sometimes and not see the cause. In making a decision to call for an inspection or not, based on personal inspection of the crawl space opens you up to additional liability. I personally would limit my call for an inspection based on what I experienced while walking and jumping on the floor inside the house. If it's bad, call for an inspection. If not, make your comments in the report and leave it at that.

The more "inspecting" you do, the greater your liability and the further you get from what you went to the house for: To gather relevant data in order to form an opinion of value.

 

[Atlanta CG]

My concern would be in areas such as a bathroom where moisture is always prevalent, or perhaps in the kitchen near a sink. Past or present leaks could cause the joists or subfloor to give out and hence be a safety issue. I'm nowhere near the size of many of the forumites as they occasionally report, but at 215 lbs if the floor near the tub or sink drops significantly when I simply step on it, then I report it, or at least do more research to determine why it is happening. Otherwise, I agree with the others. Here, in Georgia, old is 20 years. In Boston where I spent the majority of my years, some of our homes were over 150 years old and despite the drops and bends the floors were as solid as concrete and our relatives live there today with nary a problem.

 

[Jungle Boy]

Not fair, I say !

U heavy set guys have an advantage over us lite weights in detecting weak floors.

 

[Mike Garrett RAA]

Call for an inspection by a licensed contractor.