WiFi / Bluetooth Digital Camera

[Gavin Mesner]

Anyone using a WiFi / Bluetooth Digital Camera to transfer photos to a computer? How smoothly does the transfer occur?

 

[Couch Potato]

How the transfer occurs depends on the software being used. It can be anything from functioning like a cable to automatic placement in a report by your report software.

 

[DaveH]

I use my cell phone (iphone) for the photos. No complaints from anyone and the transfer is quick and easy.

 

[Randall Garrett]

The only modern/affordable compact camera I know of that fits the bill is the Panasonic Lumix DMC-TZ50S. The others I know of either do not have a wide-angle lens or are more pricey (for a reason.) The TZ50S is 9.1 MP camera with a Leica-design 28mm - 280mm (equiv.) zoom, Optical Image Stabilization and built-in WiFi b/g. It commonly runs about $350 - $380 at various discount shops, the typical Internet sites, etc. They market this camera as being able to upload to various services (i.e. T-Mobile, Google Picasa Web Albums, etc.) but I have yet to see if it could easily be connected in a "peer-to-peer" type fashion to one's own "local machine" with the provided tools. I'll take a look at this later this fall after we finish up with some other projects. Below are some links to this camera for those interested.

Announcement and basic info: http://tinyurl.com/559dyv

User review with sample images: http://tinyurl.com/5gz9ek


Hope this helps!

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/

 

[Gavin Mesner]

Thanks Randall...

 

[Couch Potato]

As long as it uses SD cards any camera can have WiFi using one of these.

 

[Randall Garrett]

Thanks, CP! In my haste to get away yesterday, I forgot to post on the Eye-Fi card. FWIW, this device is essentially a 2 GB storage chip and a low strength WiFi radio packaged into an SD format... meaning it looks and acts as a 2 GB SD card with built-in WiFi. Compared to most WiFi radios, the one in the Eye-Fi card is pretty weak, but that really doesn't matter as it doesn't need to transmit very far for our purposes...

Note that all radios like this will drop off in actual throughput over distance - the "real" radios with more power available, better antennas, etc. will simply reach further and be faster at distances over a few feet than ones that have more compromises in them due to design. The sheer convenience of turning your favorite existing camera into one that can be connected wirelessly is an appealing notion!

The big issue for what I think most of our customers envision using either the Eye-Fi solution or a regular consumer-grade camera with built-in WiFi is that of connection/communication. Most of these solutions are geared around the thought that you, the consumer, want to take pictures and be able to upload them wirelessly to a web site... either for safety/back-up or in the "let's automatically send these to grandma and family friends", etc. Hooking this stuff up to a "local" computer - i.e. to eliminate the cable and just be able to take a subject or comp shot and have it magically load up into your photo database, forms software or whatever, is NOT what these are designed for. Could it be done? Possibly. We beta tested the early Eye-Fi card and ran into difficulties (same with most early low end BT/WiFi cameras) and basically ran into the problem that the manufacturers didn't see enough of a market here to devote time to it. Neither were they interested in listening to the proposal that "we will do all the work to make this happen if you simply open up the API in whatever fashion you want." These people (rightfully?) have their sights set on millions of copies of their stuff, so even if EVERY appraiser bought one (the mythical 100,000 appraisers), they don't see where they will make any money... :-( Of course, the reality is that they will not sell millions of these to regular consumers either. The notion is interesting, but ultimately, there are cheaper SD cards out there (and more reliable, faster, bigger, etc.) and there are better (same parameters) cameras out there and so the masses will bypass these solutions and get more mainstream devices... :-(

Now, there ARE wireless cameras that are made by people who DO cater to people with similar needs. The main problem is that they are much more expensive and have specs that are not as appealing to the masses. Hence, most people don't really consider them... Even if they actually work better for the intended purpose(s), even if their adoption would actually help folks get more work done, people don't seem anxious to (say) buy a 28mm-100mm camera with working WiFi for (say) $1,000 when they read about a $300 camera with WiFi that has a 28mm-280mm lens, despite the fact that the latter one won't actually hook up they way they envisioned... Hence, they end up with a so-so $300 camera with a feature they don't really use, although they paid for it, LOL. They would be better off getting a $250 camera with the same (similar) lens and saving the $50...

All is not lost, however. I spoke of the early Eye-Fi card. The newer version have more flexibility, though I am not sure if the "peer-to-peer" (an ancient nomenclature, LOL) thing is workable yet. There simply has not been enough interest from customers to get back onto this aspect. I'd love to look into it again, but just look at the number of "reads" here and compare it with other topics to note that other items are of more interest to appraisers today. Right now, there is simply more interest in other markets with the more sophisticated (and costly) solutions. The good news is that this sort of thing has a way of "trickling down" to a more "consumer grade" version as time passes. Hence, we may see something on this which may be of real interest to most appraisers sometime later this year or next... (?)

That said, I do NOT mean to sound negative on this. I just want to point out some things to those reading this thread so you won't rush out and buy something with the notion that it'll all "just work" and then end up disappointed/frustrated. Right now, I don't think many appraisers have excess disposable income to throw at "maybe" stuff. Now, IF we or someone else finds out that any of these solutions DO have an easy to implement method to hook up to your typical laptop/tablet/whatever, then this changes things... I simply don't have time right now to "push this particular envelope"... I'd love to because it looks promising, but I think it'll be later this year before we can get back to it. So, unless someone else can shed more pertinent light on this, I would recommend bypassing these solutions and looking elsewhere for productivity gains for right now.

Again, I don't mean to throw cold water on anything, cast disparaging remarks toward any particular product, or any of that. I am just offering what I know, what we've experienced so far in hopes it is of benefit to the appraisal community. If I have missed anything, please let me know and I'll look into it and in true geek fashion, be happily prepared to say "I stand corrected..." and dive back into this stuff!

I hope this helps.

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/

 

[Couch Potato]

I was told the EyeFi card does not work peer to peer. From the information I have gathered I would need to put a cheap hub in my car, have ClickFORMS running on my laptop with the photo cell where I want the picture selected, set the photo preference for ClickFORMS to look for photos where EyeFi wants to put them, snap the picture and it would go into the report automatically.

I would love to give it a try, but my current camera uses XD Cards. I was about to buy a new camera and an EyeFi card, but I had an unexpected expense that took that money.
(Someday I'll learn to say no to my daughter. )

 

[Gavin Mesner]

Correct Couch. I purchased and then returned the EyeFi card. You NEED a router in order to transfer data wireless directly into your computer. Good product, but not good enough right now.

 

[Randall Garrett]

I'll let y'all know if/when we do something that'll make something like an Eye-Fi card work without a router. We have a few larger customers who have a need very similar to what I believe you want to do and they have asked us to look into this sort of thing. That said, as I mentioned before, those that are already doing this are simply using different hardware. Their volume and needs for efficiency gains made it more feasible to work with more expensive equipment and more or less just work right out of the box (very little "custom" programming - just high level stuff) and put the solution to work more quickly. These sorts of customers tend to hold onto their equipment for 3 - 5 years so it makes sense for them to spend a bit more up front and get the efficiency gains working sooner. Outside of breakage issues (drops, rain, etc.), most fee appraiser types tend to hold onto cameras for that long, too, but the lure of ever-increasing MP and other features at cheap prices tends to steer them toward items which are more consumer-oriented vs. "business class." In most cases, we find that just a little more spent on decent stuff actually pays off quicker than we tend to recognize. You don't always really have to jump from (say) a $250 camera to a $1,000 camera... sometimes (again, just an example) spending another $100 or so is what makes the difference between something that works and hold up to the daily demands of the profession vs. something that breaks easily or in other ways becomes the dreaded "paper weight"... :-( We see this in laptops - generally speaking, the consumer-oriented units seen in the big box stores have the allure of a really low price but tend to fail under mobile appraiser usage. Most don't really need a fully ruggedized laptop, but spending a few percentage points more to a "business class" device makes a difference.

Please note that I am not selling anything - I am simply reporting what we've found as observed from and reported by our users in the different valuation-related industries we service...

Hope this helps!

-Randall Garrett-
..Apex Software..

/end/