Acceptable apprentice hours

[ROBERT JONES]

Timothy - are you saying that "teaching" geo-competancy is not teaching? I do not make the rules. There is a pre-set number of hours that I have to train this person properly. Most anyone could look through an MLS system and come up with a value. Geo-comp is critical in my area where city sections are often divided by one street. - Why accuse me of being part of the problem? - and what problem is that? I need to have an apprentice so that I can spend time with my family and not a computer screen 19 hours a day.

 

[Lawrence R.]

Insane

It is insane to use some type of "hours spent" honor system to license people anyway.

Hell, use whatever you want, there is NO WAY to verify it any way.

Forget the obvoius argument that one appraiser can do an appraisal in half the time of another and develop the same basic report...that is irrelevant. The idea that 2 people can sit down and decide for themselves what amount of time was spent "working" on an assignment and then submit that to a board who will then do what? Look at the amount of hours vs the amount of appraisals and decide in thier own wisdom if it "looks reasonable"?

Do we really need a REAB with one more unchecked power?

Crazy. Just flat out crazy.

 

[GCJim]

I am kind of shocked at the original post.
Is it the goal to reach the experience hours in the least amount of time so we may have another appraiser with minimal experience?
This is the problem with our profession.......

Frankly, I'm surprised that a simple, valid question like this is getting responses that are just jumping to wild conclusions....... In addition, should we do MORE, spend MORE, work at less than sustenance levels for MORE years to get a certification? (e.g., Should I spend 5 years working on a 4-year degree? 30 hours on a 15 hour course?) Please let's get realistic here.......how about we assume that persons interested in getting a certification are interested in learning all that they can, in a reasonable amount of time, to the best of their ability, until proven otherwise.
True, some abuse the system, but at least he is asking the question here instead of using whatever hours he wants.

To answer the question, (FWIW), I have spent as little as 3-1/2 to 4 hours on a full residential appraisal (I don't think a full appraisal can be done in much less time, unless you are a speed typist and have a previous file with most of the needed data already in it), and I have probably spent as much as 48 hours or more on a very complex residential appraisal. I used and declared the actual hours spent inspecting, sketching, researching, typing, visits to the tax assessor, visits to the zoning dept, and some of the driving time. My logs, however, have many more hours and assignments than the bare minimum needed for several certifications.
I would use discretion: if it takes an hour each way to get to your subject, SHOULD you declare a full additional 2 hours? (I wouldn't, but that's me).

 

[Delta85]

I am kind of shocked at the original post.

Is it the goal to reach the experience hours in the least amount of time so we may have another appraiser with minimal experience?

This is the problem with our profession. The mindset that it is a race to get the minimal amount of time in to reach the hours, take the minimal amount of classes, and then take the easy test and then suddenly we have produced another "appraiser".

If this trainee is learning the business and is not geo-competant in the area you are appraising in then we have a totally different problem, and you are asking the state to recognize drive time for experience hours? Does the trainee not know the area?

What is wrong with teaching a trainee the correct way to appraise, get real experience hours, and have them do it for 3-4 years in residential appraising before they are set free to get their license?

This is the time (in this unfriendly appraiser economy) to train new people in the business (profession) correctly and not look for shortcuts for them to get their hours in a minimal amount of time.

Be part of the solution, not part of the problem.

Give me a break. Just becuase someone wishes to include drive time in their total hours does not mean they are gonna be any less competent appraisers. These types of shortcuts are common in professions more respectable than appraising.

I have a second job working with young adults with autism and every year we take on several interns from Yale University volunteering time for credits toward a psychology or medical degree. They are often scheduled for up to 4 hours to be with us in a day and many times leave after only 2-3 and take credit for the full 4. There is nothing I can do about it.

 

[DJBanas]

Robert:

I had the same question when I was a trainee in NJ (2003-2005). I called the state office and talked to a gentleman (I don't remember the name) who said driving "to" the assigment would usually not be considered as trainee time. He said, however, that once in the neighborhood and I started looking at neighborhood conditions, comps, etc. that this is when the clock should start. This is what I used on my trainee logs.

 

[Michigan CG]

Frankly, I'm surprised that a simple, valid question like this is getting responses that are just jumping to wild conclusions....... In addition, should we do MORE YES, spend MORE YES, work at less than sustenance levels for MORE years to get a certification YES? (e.g., Should I spend 5 years working on a 4-year degree? 30 hours on a 15 hour course?) Please let's get realistic here.......how about we assume that persons interested in getting a certification are interested in learning all that they can, in a reasonable amount of time, to the best of their ability, until proven otherwise.
True, some abuse the system, but at least he is asking the question here instead of using whatever hours he wants.

Mr. GCJIM,

If you look back at past threads there are many instances in where the common goal was a race to the finish with the least amount of time and effort. Some of it was down right disgusting.

This question resembles those posts. To obtain 2,500 hours of experience you can work 63 weeks at 40 hours a week and get the hours in. Do you think that this profession can be learned in 14 months? Do you think that a person can after 14 months be competent to appraise ANY residential property (A certified Residential Appraiser is licensed to do just that).

The educational and experience requirements are still to low and there are those still racing to get the minimum amount of education and experience so they may go out and hang up their own shingle not knowing what they do not know.

Most of the CG appraisers on this site think that one should have five years of experience before ever attempting to go on their own, yet the experience hours would only take 88 weeks at 40 hours.

It is my humble opinion that drive time learning neighborhood boundaries is a little over the edge. This is taught in basic appraisal courses.

Some day down the road when you are Certified after a few years, come back and look up your opinions on this forum and you will realize the naivety of your thoughts.

There are plenty of average Joe appraisers that spent the minimal, worked the minimal and did the minimal, and they will always remain as just average appraisers. Ask yourself if you want to be average Joe or the guy they call to the divorce case because they know you will have the most credible report because you did more, spent more and put more effort in to your training and education.

DO MORE: Read three or four residential appraisal books; it isn't required but it educates you more. Read the 12th Edition front to back, that will give you an idea of what you don't know.

SPEND MORE: Take classes you don't have to take to better yourself. Take classes from reputable providers, take CE above the minimum requirements. You don't have to do any of this but it will make you a better appraiser.

TAKE MORE TIME: Two years will not make you a fully competent appraiser, it just won't.

 

[Michigan CG]

Give me a break. Just becuase someone wishes to include drive time in their total hours does not mean they are gonna be any less competent appraisers. These types of shortcuts are common in professions more respectable than appraising.

And because others do it it is OK?

 

[Lawrence R.]

Give me a break.

(edited out stuff I didn't want to talk about)

They are often scheduled for up to 4 hours to be with us in a day and many times leave after only 2-3 and take credit for the full 4. There is nothing I can do about it.

You couldn't call someone and require them to come back and complete thier hours? I will refer you to your opening statement.