Adapt or Die?

[ockyappraiser]

"If our clients only want yugos then stop making us build suvs!"

You make a good point. We are "selling" our knowledge. Our "inventory" is our available time to produce our reports and do our research. Why is it that so many appraisers resist newer appraisal products that take less time?

If a company came to me today at asked me to do 10 2070 inspections per day for $100 each. . .and drop all my other work. . .would I do it? Don't get between me and the car keys!

The business person is always looking at cost, inventory and margin. Those that are going to make it in the future are going to have to work with both AMC's and local clients. . .have 24 hour turn times or less. . .and demonstrate that they are capable of using the highest tech products out there for delivery, etc.

 

[Tudor]

As soon as the Industry starts demanding, ethics, experience and competence, then I can survive, until then.......well?

 

[JTFAPP]

Im not sure if stubborn is the right word rather sensible. Hey Im all for adjusting to what the market is demanding, and we have with all sorts of cute goofy forms, fine. A lot of these appraisals are rubber stamps, so I understand some demand for quick less quality NUMBERS, but our job is mostly about liability, and they want to sell these loans with said attached liability. So Im OK with market change, but to have to produce less involved, USPAP lacking, limited junk is not good for a Licensed regulated, scrutinized appraiser.

 

[Tudor]

"If our clients only want yugos then stop making us build suvs!"

You make a good point. We are "selling" our knowledge. Our "inventory" is our available time to produce our reports and do our research. Why is it that so many appraisers resist newer appraisal products that take less time?

If a company came to me today at asked me to do 10 2070 inspections per day for $100 each. . .and drop all my other work. . .would I do it? Don't get between me and the car keys!

The business person is always looking at cost, inventory and margin. Those that are going to make it in the future are going to have to work with both AMC's and local clients. . .have 24 hour turn times or less. . .and demonstrate that they are capable of using the highest tech products out there for delivery, etc.[/QUOTE]

my bold

To accomplish this, something must be sacrificed, which is usually some part of the appraisal process. We all know what those are.

 

[Mike Boyd]

If a company came to me today at asked me to do 10 2070 inspections per day for $100 each. . .and drop all my other work. . .would I do it? Don't get between me and the car keys!

If they will pay $100 for an exterior only 2070 and if the client CERTIFIES that the property is owner-occupied, AND if they promised 10 a day, WHO wouldn't accept the offer?

However, I have never heard of any lender making such a guaranty. Have you? If you have, give me the name and contact and I will give you a modest cut on each one (after the first week)

 

[Stone]

It's pretty easy to say that these fast and cheap products can be done by appraisers pursuant to the sow rules in USPAP. But after a quick review of USPAP sow provisions it looks like any appraiser that is doing them is literally walking through a minefield. I don't care how goodl your sow cya language is-there are way too many landmines in that field. Who knows how the USPAP police will interpret ao 28 and 29. To me USPAP is written such that no one in their right mind would jump into that lake with the 1,000 lb USPAP back of rocks strapped to them!

Therefore, I still say that because of USPAP appraisers cannot effectively compete for a large share of the market demand for appraisal related services and I still say if the lenders have a need for a lesser quality product and that need is being met by less qualified realtors or products then it would be a whole lot better to let the more qualified certified appraisers produce these products. If our clients only want yugos then stop making us build suvs!

Now you are back to just wanting to do the garbage work without the limitations and responsibilities that come with being an appraiser.

Is it more work for an appraiser to do the garbage work than it is for a realtor? Of course. But, it isn't nearly as impossible as you are interpreting it. It can be done. You have to decide if you can do it and make money. But, this stuff about wanting out of USPAP for this crap work is just silly. You are an appraiser. If you don't want to be an appraiser, go do all the bpos you want. Don't advocate trashing our product so you can do $50 garbabe assignments.

Appraisers are different from RE agents and others and should continue to be so. I understand where you are coming from, but I think you are really short-sighted. Stick to actually being an appraiser and find some clients who actually want appraisals.

 

[Elliott]

Since this thread is about 'pricing'....I remembered this article by Jim Blasingame and
thought how it applies to the struggle with the $140 1004.

"Why you are worth more.

1. You know how to do things your clients don't.
2. You know how to do things your clients don't have time to do themselves, even if they knew how.
3. Your clients don't have to adopt you, they rent you. And then send you home when your work is delivered.

"Take a lesson from the rental industry. A rental car costs $50 a day. That works out to $1500 a month for a car that you could own for $350 a month. But you didn't think of it like that when you rent a car, do you? You had a special need, the rental company delivered the product and provided a valuable service just in time, and you gave it back when you were finished. No muss, no fuss. Just like when a company rents you.
Write this on a rock... When you price your personal services, think like a rental car company.

http://www.smallbusinessadvocate.com/small-business-help-articles/how-much-are-you-worth_45.html

 

[SANDY]

This is not at all about what it is and what it is not to be a professional or what is or is not a crappy product. Time to get off that horse. It is about looking around and seeing what is happening around you in the bigger picture. For some the overal bigger picture may not yet be upon you but it is on its way soon.

You cannot expect to continue selling a product that the market does not want anymore especially, especially, especially when someone else has moved into town(so to speak) that is let me say again--is selling what people want!! Problem is even if we want to sell the same product for the same price and we can produce it better, we can only do so if we are willing to carry around this 1000 lb bag of USPAP question marks that depending upon any one of a number of users or regulators interpretation can be used against us at any time.

Try this----can anyone here --- anyone---- post this iron clad USPAP sow compliant language without anyone here bangin on it from any one of a zillion angles on why and how it isn't USPAP compliant? Go ahead and try!!! Realtors can!!! avms can!!!! Zaio and zillow can!!!! Because they are not regulated.

Why are some of you so wrapped up so tight about whether this would destroy the profession. Reasonable people with reasonable minds(paticularly others in the mortgage process) can understand the differences between the reliability of a BPO like product done by an appraiser and a full blown 1004 appraisal done by an appraiser why can't you folks? -the users know full well what they are purchasing.
When you go to the doctor for a routine check-up do you always get full blown blood-work, prostate exam, ekg, pet scan, bone marrow sample, etc, etc...... Hell no! So is your general practitioner going to insist on a minimum $1,000 fee for an office visit or does it start with a more reasonable fee for some routine tests and if nothing comes up the product has been delivered? Is the doctor not considered a professional because he doesn't perform the full blown tests himself or do open heart surgery. So if your an appraiser why can't you choose the routine exams and do the heart surgery too if your qualified?

No more poundage-no more poundage-if ya doesn't want it we shouldn't have to be the ones to shove down yer throats anyway. But if ya does want it or need it we can provide that too because the users are the ones payin for it so they should be the ones to choose the level of service they want.

 

[JSmith43]

Now you are back to just wanting to do the garbage work without the limitations and responsibilities that come with being an appraiser.

Is it more work for an appraiser to do the garbage work than it is for a realtor? Of course. But, it isn't nearly as impossible as you are interpreting it. It can be done. You have to decide if you can do it and make money. But, this stuff about wanting out of USPAP for this crap work is just silly. You are an appraiser. If you don't want to be an appraiser, go do all the bpos you want. Don't advocate trashing our product so you can do $50 garbabe assignments.

Appraisers are different from RE agents and others and should continue to be so. I understand where you are coming from, but I think you are really short-sighted. Stick to actually being an appraiser and find some clients who actually want appraisals.

Stone, you are following the adventures of Ray M and the WI board, I assume. I'll cut you some slack since I don't want to goad you into public comments and possible retribution, but aren't we arguing how many stones are in the sac on the back of the USPAP laden swimmer?

It is definitely an uneven playing field, and it is not just because of standards. NAR members have reasonably high ethical standards when it comes to BPO's, just minimal enforcement options. Whereas, in WI, an appraiser can follow USPAP flawlessly and still get busted at the board level via creative interpretation. Most appraisers don't have pockets, pride and willpower as deep as Ray.

 

[Stone]

This is not at all about what it is and what it is not to be a professional or what is or is not a crappy product. Time to get off that horse. It is about looking around and seeing what is happening around you in the bigger picture. For some the overal bigger picture may not yet be upon you but it is on its way soon.

You cannot expect to continue selling a product that the market does not want anymore especially, especially, especially when someone else has moved into town(so to speak) that is let me say again--is selling what people want!! Problem is even if we want to sell the same product for the same price and we can produce it better, we can only do so if we are willing to carry around this 1000 lb bag of USPAP question marks that depending upon any one of a number of users or regulators interpretation can be used against us at any time.

Try this----can anyone here --- anyone---- post this iron clad USPAP sow compliant language without anyone here bangin on it from any one of a zillion angles on why and how it isn't USPAP compliant? Go ahead and try!!! Realtors can!!! avms can!!!! Zaio and zillow can!!!! Because they are not regulated.

Why are some of you so wrapped up so tight about whether this would destroy the profession. Reasonable people with reasonable minds(paticularly others in the mortgage process) can understand the differences between the reliability of a BPO like product done by an appraiser and a full blown 1004 appraisal done by an appraiser why can't you folks? -the users know full well what they are purchasing.
When you go to the doctor for a routine check-up do you always get full blown blood-work, prostate exam, ekg, pet scan, bone marrow sample, etc, etc...... Hell no! So is your general practitioner going to insist on a minimum $1,000 fee for an office visit or does it start with a more reasonable fee for some routine tests and if nothing comes up the product has been delivered? Is the doctor not considered a professional because he doesn't perform the full blown tests himself or do open heart surgery. So if your an appraiser why can't you choose the routine exams and do the heart surgery too if your qualified?

No more poundage-no more poundage-if ya doesn't want it we shouldn't have to be the ones to shove down yer throats anyway. But if ya does want it or need it we can provide that too because the users are the ones payin for it so they should be the ones to choose the level of service they want.

As to this question:

Try this----can anyone here --- anyone---- post this iron clad USPAP sow compliant language without anyone here bangin on it from any one of a zillion angles on why and how it isn't USPAP compliant? Go ahead and try!!! Realtors can!!! avms can!!!! Zaio and zillow can!!!! Because they are not regulated.

There is no such thing as a report or SOW language that couldn't be picked apart here. Not for the garbage you are discussing or for a 100+ page report that goes into serious detail of everything.

That is a silly test.

And...


The doctor analogy is so flawed it almost works for the opposite argument. The doctor is just as liable no matter what he/she orders for tests, etc. When you leave the room, that doctor is still doing a ton of paperwork explaining his/her SOW, as it were. The doctor doesn't get to ignore his rules/code of ethics because it was a reasonably easy diagnosis. And, the doctor certainly doesn't get to ignore his/her rules just because the patient wants it or because some homeopathic guru in a shopping mall doesn't have to follow it.

Time to get off that horse.

Funny, I could say the same. Despite your new analogies, you are on the same horse as you were in the OP. You continue to repeat that USPAP makes it too hard. Bull. You simply want to not have to comply and still call yourself an appraiser. I should have realized this was all it boiled down to.