Detached living space not valued in appraisal

[jjonak]

I have no idea at all why you, or anyone, would think it would "help" if appraisers are paid "as little as" you would suspect. Nor would I remotely think anything regarding your situation has improved whatsoever when some appraiser informs you they only have half an hour and must do everything in a rush.

Like I said, welcome to the world of AMCs, and lenders allowing them to select the worst of the worst, the cheapest of the cheapest, and the result most likely to be work rushed so fast that it is meaningless.

I think you misunderstood me. I don't think it "helps" to pay appraisers less. I would vastly prefer someone who did a really quality job. But since that doesn't seem to be in the cards with lender hires, I think the comps will be more helpful to an appraiser who is paid less, has to rush, and therefore has less time to research comps herself.

 

[Webbed Feet]

I think you misunderstood me. I don't think it "helps" to pay appraisers less. I would vastly prefer someone who did a really quality job. But since that doesn't seem to be in the cards with lender hires, I think the comps will be more helpful to an appraiser who is paid less, has to rush, and therefore has less time to research comps herself.

I see. I appreciate your view on that. From my side it is disconcerting to admit to the public that this trade has been driven down to the point I'd have to say I appreciate such a view however.

Don't know if this will be helpful or not, but I note you are in Oregon.. In my area, the general Portland area, I can't think of any major to semi-major "water front" property that would not be a complex real estate appraisal situation. About the only time I ever spend as little as 30 minutes at a subject property is when it is a 1,100 sqft rectangle in SE Portland. I allow at least an hour for all property viewings that include an interior viewing. If I can get done in less time, wonderful! .. But I never plan on just 30 minutes.

 

[jjonak]

I see. I appreciate your view on that. From my side it is disconcerting to admit to the public that this trade has been driven down to the point I'd have to say I appreciate such a view however.

Don't know if this will be helpful or not, but I note you are in Oregon.. In my area, the general Portland area, I can't think of any major to semi-major "water front" property that would not be a complex real estate appraisal situation. About the only time I ever spend as little as 30 minutes at a subject property is when it is a 1,100 sqft rectangle in SE Portland. I allow at least an hour for all property viewings that include an interior viewing. If I can get done in less time, wonderful! .. But I never plan on just 30 minutes.

Thanks so much! I was really surprised when the appraiser told me by phone that "it will only take me 30 minutes," and that's when I thought, whoa, I better prepare as much as I can.

It's actually a multiple parcel property being refinanced with several different outbuildings spread out over 45 acres, not to mention a very large interior dwelling with several detached living space areas. I know when we lived in California, I used to have some choice in the appraiser hired and got to hire some great ones. I wish the appraisers down here (Eugene area) were more like you!

Maybe as the economy picks back up, there will be more value placed on a thorough job. Who knows, maybe my reporting the inaccuracies on the last report to the lender might be a small help in that direction.

I was also really happy to hear this appraiser tell me that she would give some adjustment to market comps based on whether they also had water frontage. The last appraiser gave no adjustment at all. So fingers crossed! Thanks again everyone for all your advice!

 

[BRCJR]

..................................................................................................................................................(and the new appraiser told me by phone that she only has time to spend half an hour and needs to do everything on a rush).

and that bothers me.................................

 

[CANative]

a 2400 sq ft greenhouse,

Growing "orchids?" lol

You should complain LOUDLY to your lender about the quality of this appraisal and ask them how much the appraiser was paid, versus what YOU paid, versus what the AMC was paid. The reason your getting a $200 appraisal and paying your lender well over $400 is due to the greed of both the lender and the AMC. Not to mention the stupidity of the desparate appraiser.

What sort of "waterfront" do you have? Creek, river, small lake?

 

[The Warrior Monk]

I'm working on a refinance of our home, and we have 800-900 square feet of finished living space that the appraiser did not include in the appraisal. This space is above-grade, was fully permitted with our building department, and I pay taxes on it thanks to an increased tax assessment of our house as a result. It is plumbed and wired for kitchen appliances, so it could function in future as an in-law, although it is not currently used as such. It is a large building that is attached to our carport and 2 car garage, and it has a 500 square foot studio with 20 foot cathedral ceilings, a bedroom and a full bathroom. The level of finish is excellent - hardwood floors, its own heat pump, its own electrical panel, septic, custom tiled full bath with footed tub, etc.

It is not attached to our main house.

There are conventions that are used in appraising, especially for residential lending assignments.

In your case, the additional structure doesn't sound like it is necessary to the function of the main dwelling, thus it is not included in the gross living area.

In any market value appraisal for lending, the property must be described accurately, and the appropriate adjustment reflecting the contributory value of the improvements must be made.

Though not applicable to your assignments, there are dwellings built that consist of more than one building. The best example of this I've seen to date a bayfront contemporary-style residence consisting of one building with the entertaining areas (kitchen, dining room, living room) and a separate building consisting of sleeping quarters. The buildings were connected by a covered, open-air deck. I would consider both buildings as gross living area, since the use of these buildings are absolutely necessary to each other's function.

 

[Webbed Feet]

<....snip.....>
Maybe as the economy picks back up, there will be more value placed on a thorough job. Who knows, maybe my reporting the inaccuracies on the last report to the lender might be a small help in that direction.

I was also really happy to hear this appraiser tell me that she would give some adjustment to market comps based on whether they also had water frontage. The last appraiser gave no adjustment at all. So fingers crossed! Thanks again everyone for all your advice!

The more you disclose about your property the unhappier I get about your first appraiser and about hearing that ANY appraiser in Oregon thinks they are going to inspect such a property in 30 minutes or under. While I could appreciate your lender may have ordered the second assignment as a "Rush," that doesn't mean any appraiser is allowed to violate USPAP and state administrative rules in Oregon in order to rush the job. Nor does the economy allow that, nor does what they are getting paid allow that.

45 acreas, multiple parcels, some sort of water frontage, an Accessory Dwelling Unit (ADU) larger than some peoples houses, multiple outbuildings, multiple septic systems, possible zoning issues and highest and best issues due to multiple parcels, for all I know access aspects to discuss over shared access to public right of ways as well! .... Then... "wells" at at that too. And this stupid nimrod gal you having coming out thinks she can inspect, MEASURE, all that in 30 minutes or under?



It takes me the first five minutes just to say hello, explain what all I am going to do, ask if everybody is dressed / decent and I have access to everywhere, and ask if there are any questions before I get started!!!

Unless the new appraiser is showing up with two assistants, think you should be contacting your lender this morning and explaining if they can't obtain the services of a real estate appraiser that has more than 30 minutes of their time to inspect your property properly, and do a good job, that you will be finding some other lender that has respect for their customers. And, they can plan on returning that first appraisal fee, not over a value dispute, but over allowing incompetents to be hired. I've read enough here that, unless something involved in viewing your property and looking over that first appraisal changed my mind, I would be filing a state appraisal board complaint regarding the first appraisal.

Oregon Appraisers Certification and Licensure Board (503) 484-2555 Reporting the inaccuracies to the state appraisal board will be a help in the right direction.

 

[jjonak]

Well, I had a surprising call today from the lender. They told me that the appraiser who came out yesterday to do the appraisal called and said that because I gave her comps, she felt that I was trying to unduly influence her appraisal and she would be too biased to complete the appraisal. They said this was a violation of the Home Value Code of Conduct and that appraisers are not allowed to discuss any kind of valuation with the homeowner.

I was pretty surprised given that the appraiser specifically asked me for copies of the first appraisal done and what comps were used and gave me her email address to send them to her (which I didn't, hadn't gotten around to it because was wondering if sending a report that was inaccurate made sense).

They are going to send out a third appraiser and said that the second appraiser hadn't charged anything for her visit.

So frustrating! I just know they are going to send someone that will also have no time to even look at the property. It's 5000 sq ft with a shop, 2 barns, tennis court, detached studio and garages, greenhouse and 3 other smaller outbuildings. And what I told the appraiser yesterday was simply that I thought one of the most valuable features of the property was its waterfront - it has 1/4 mile of river frontage including boat ramp and dock (both of which can no longer be built - in fact you can't build houses at all along the river here because of greenway regulations), and that therefore I felt that it needed to be compared to river frontage. I didn't interpret that as trying to bias her. I wonder if she just decided that the whole thing would take longer than it was worth the lender paying? Or that I just keep my mouth shut when the third person comes?

To answer your questions, greenhouse was to grow citrus trees and the frontage is riverfront. It's a great river for canoeing, swimming, rafting or fishing, and the water rights are terrific for irrigation. It's also just beautiful because with the dock, we line up chairs and umbrella and have a gorgeous spot with no other development in view (building restrictions now in effect on river) but are only 10 min from downtown/University of Oregon.

 

[jjonak]

This is also really weird. When the appraiser asked me to email her the first appraisal report, I asked for a card. She said she didn't have any and gave me a Yahoo email address. I do have her name and number just from what she told me by phone (and caller ID). When I look it up in the Oregon appraiser's database, there is no one there with that record and when I google her, I can only find a few references. I've tried spelling it several different ways. By contrast, the first appraiser does appear to be licensed, in the database, at least. Maybe the license is under some old name, but isn't that odd?

 

[The Warrior Monk]

This is also really weird. When the appraiser asked me to email her the first appraisal report, I asked for a card. She said she didn't have any and gave me a Yahoo email address. I do have her name and number just from what she told me by phone (and caller ID). When I look it up in the Oregon appraiser's database, there is no one there with that record and when I google her, I can only find a few references. I've tried spelling it several different ways. By contrast, the first appraiser does appear to be licensed, in the database, at least. Maybe the license is under some old name, but isn't that odd?

I recommend following up on this issue. Maybe someone in Oregon would be kind enough to help you, or I will if necessary. While I'm not going make judgments yet, that are firms that send out people that are licensed, or are unqualified to perform certain duties, and I personally have no tolerance for these people.