FANNIE bonds with AMCs, over your dead low paid body.

[George Hatch]

Exactly- when the fee is broken out in the appraisal report, it is a done deal and too late for the borrower to object to, and many might not even read that far into a report at that point- vs having it bold type, disclosed up front when they apply for a loan.
'
The dirty secret is that when the borrower applies for the loan, they KNOW what the appraisal fee is ( $600 for example ). But the dirty secret is that when the borrower applies for the loan, they do not know what split of their $600 is kept by an AMC ( or even if an AMC is being used )

The fun part is that it would be impossible for the lender to break out the fee to the borrower at application unless the AMC was on a cost-plus basis ( AMC keeps the same $150 regardless of which appraiser is chosen. But in the current system, where most AMCs are not on cost plus, they hold flea market style bids or search for low fees, so the lender does not know what the appraiser /AMC fee breakout will be, so they can not disclose it up front.

It is the opposite of a public trust mission and the transparency they allude to..

The only discretion a borrower has on the appraisal side is to either accept or reject the lender's deal as a whole. Picking AMCs is just as far outside of their control as is picking appraisers.

 

[J Grant]

I know you won't answer this, and we all know why you won't. When you look at the fees you pay for CE over a renewal cycle, the total is probably comparable to what a consumer pays for an appraisal. and you have to do that every time you renew, while consumers only have to pay for appraisals when they get new loans. If what you assert about consumers and fees is correct, why have I never seen one thread here about the concern for instructor fees?

I would wager that you have never in your life asked a school what they were paying the instructor or expressed concern that the appraiser instructor was getting a fair wage. We all just assume that the fee paid to the instructor is acceptable or the instructor would not be teaching the class.

I would care about what they paid the instructors if the CE course was garbage and /or did not meet state approval for credits when I apply to renew my license.

Answered elsewhere for the other reasons, it was not an apt comparison, but the above answer addresses a similarity.

 

[Sandra Koutsopoulos]

So you are proposing that the lender allow the borrower to shop AMCs and/or appraisers? I know what some of the AMCs charge and it is less than what the pay me. So which fee will catch the borrowers eye

I'm not saying Borrower should decide who the appraiser is, because they don't have the experience and knowledge to know whether one appraiser is more competent than another for his particular loan. It would make sense that lenders have a list of AMCs, and their fees separate from appraisal fee, which could be a $ range. In fact, when I contacted escrow companies to provide their potential closing statements for a transaction, the fees they listed were fairly general within a range tied to sale price, so that I could analyze what worked best for the particular transaction. We are familiar with add-on fees for things like RUSH, or 3000+ sf GLA, or acreage, or multiple units etc. So a chart of typical fees could note the add-on fees for a particular situation. Lenders could take that into consideration when quoting estimated costs to Borrower.

Are there legitimate variances for AMC fees due to some sort of complexity or special situation? If so, those could also be on a chart of 'FEE + special circumstance'.

 

[chad hampton]

I always wondered what instructors made. But holy ****, talk about a strawman.

What another giant mental gymnastic leap that was

 

[George Hatch]

My daily rate was the same for teaching as it was for appraising. Except I didn't work for splits as an appraiser.

Personally, I don't think "Instructor" splits is that great of an example. As consumers appraisers buy all sorts of services and software and E&O and vehicle costs and such without giving any thought to how much of that transaction went to the workerbee vs the people they were working for. Appraisers watch and compare the totals of their various alternatives to each other.

In terms of goods and services there's nothing special about the appraisal business. Jake and Elwood Blues might say "we're on a mission, from God" but that doesn't apply to the appraisal business.

 

[alebrewer]

I would care about what they paid the instructors if the CE course was garbage and /or did not meet state approval for credits when I apply to renew my license.

So, applying that logic to the borrower position, they'd only care what the appraiser was paid if they believe the appraisal to be garbage...

 

[George Hatch]

The unspoken assumption there is that most of the AMC appraisals are garbage. Presumably because of the fees those appraisers are charging. .

 

[DWiley]

I always wondered what instructors made. But holy ****, talk about a strawman.

What another giant mental gymnastic leap that was

OK

When you buy a car, do you care how much the sales person is making vs the dealer or manufacturer?
When you buy milk at the grocery store, do you care how much the store is making vs the farmer vs the distributor?
When you buy gas, do you care how much the gas station owner makes, vs the clerk, vs the oil company?
When you pay for a meal in a restaurant, do you get concerned about how the owner makes vs the chef vs the waiter?
When you pay a bill at a doctor's office, do you concern yourself over the split beteeen the doctor, the nurse, etc?
When you pay your accountant, do you get worked up over how much goes to the accountant and how much to the partners in the firm?

Just give me one example where the concern over how fees/costs are split manifests itself in the way so many think it will manifest in appraisal land.

I wish somebody would make the disclosure mandatory so the whole argument would go away. I have never found anyone who is not an appraiser who cares what appraisers make.

 

[Surf Cat]

I would wager that you have never in your life asked a school what they were paying the instructor or expressed concern that the appraiser instructor was getting a fair wage.

Being curious, I stuck this question in a search engine.

Are instructors for continuing education for real estate appraisers, complaining about their pay?

Short answer:

There is no direct evidence in the provided search results indicating that instructors for real estate appraiser continuing education are publicly complaining about their pay.

Now..... change the wording to the question a little bit....

Are appraisers for real estate appraisal assignments from AMC's complaining about their pay?

Let us know the answer!

 

[gregb]

I have never found anyone who is not an appraiser who cares what appraisers make.

Do you consider an AMC to be an appraiser?