UAD 3.6?

[NC Appraising]

Fwiw,

If you have a old tablet, get a new one. It will not work on older tablets. My tablet has been glitchy when using the sketch.

Went out to practice the new uad 3.6 on my tablet...saved it and then bam. Could no longer open up mobile for total. It would crash and freeze.

Apparently you need a 15 and up version.

If you are a andriod person, costco has last year version 300 off. Last year model has the wide screen rear camera. The newer version does not.

 

[Surf Cat]

My software is up for renewal in a couple weeks so I got the call from the sales guy. Obviously, I wanted info of their 3.6 platform. Of course, it was sold as the best thing since sliced bread. “It does everything for you” was the going theme. It pulls all the data and helps quantify and this that and the other thing.

If that is true and other software programs do the same thing, two things pop out at me.

1.Appraisal files will basically go away. There will be nothing to put in them except the order form and a purchase contract. All the “data” and “support” will be uploaded to the report automatically. Which leads to:
2. Appraisers will do a lot less appraising and more just reviewing. There will be a point where appraisers will forget how to actually appraise. They won’t realize it or even care; until they are called to the carpet and have to defend in appraisal in court or an audit. They won’t know how to explain their work and it won’t matter, anyway, because they don’t have an appraisal file.

Here's what strikes me funny. This is coming from someone who hasn't even practiced or taken a class on the 3.6 yet. Yes, I have viewed it and watched a couple short videos but that's about it.

It seems to me the old certifications within the 3.6 are antiquated given the fact that AI is surrounding the whole ecosystem/new format. The software vendors are touting Automation and workflow tools. So....AI is layered around the whole appraisal process.

AI picks the comps for you, taking away from the appraiser determining the neighborhood boundaries, range of square footage, reading about the neighborhood through the comparable listings in the MLS. The one change in the certifications is that you do not have to drive the comps. The appraiser is putting more time into collecting structured data.... less time into a description narrative of the comparables in comparison to the subject.

Let's take cert 5 for example:

5. I stated in this appraisal report my own personal, unbiased, and professional analyses, opinions, and conclusions, which are subject only to the assumptions and limiting conditions in this appraisal report.

Did you really? Or did AI?

How about cert 14?

14. I based my valuation on the available properties that are most similar to the subject property.

No....AI based my valuation on the properties it picked.

Look at 21.

21. I personally prepared all conclusions and opinions about the real estate that were set forth in this appraisal report. No one provided significant real property appraisal assistance.

I personally prepared? Didn't AI provide significant assistance?

 

[J Grant]

Here's what strikes me funny. This is coming from someone who hasn't even practiced or taken a class on the 3.6 yet. Yes, I have viewed it and watched a couple short videos but that's about it.

It seems to me the old certifications within the 3.6 are antiquated given the fact that AI is surrounding the whole ecosystem/new format. The software vendors are touting Automation and workflow tools. So....AI is layered around the whole appraisal process.

AI picks the comps for you, taking away from the appraiser determining the neighborhood boundaries, range of square footage, reading about the neighborhood through the comparable listings in the MLS. The one change in the certifications is that you do not have to drive the comps. The appraiser is putting more time into collecting structured data.... less time into a description narrative of the comparables in comparison to the subject.

Let's take cert 5 for example:

5. I stated in this appraisal report my own personal, unbiased, and professional analyses, opinions, and conclusions, which are subject only to the assumptions and limiting conditions in this appraisal report.

Did you really? Or did AI?

How about cert 14?

14. I based my valuation on the available properties that are most similar to the subject property.

No....AI based my valuation on the properties it picked.

Look at 21.

21. I personally prepared all conclusions and opinions about the real estate that were set forth in this appraisal report. No one provided significant real property appraisal assistance.

I personally prepared? Didn't AI provide significant assistance?

I asked D Wiley in a post if he thinks it would be a good idea for UAD 3.6 to have an additional cert regarding how appraisers handle AI. His response was that there is Cert 5. As you observe, Cert 5 is too generic to address AI. The entities want plausible deniability because they know that the only way for an appraiser to do a UAD 3.6 cheaply and fast is to let it become AI-generated and populated, including the narrative, with minimal or no human appraiser input. The AMC model thrives on cheap and fast. Some other clients still want and pay for appraiser competence but how long will that last? IDK.

By not adding a new cert detailing how an appraiser uses AI , the GSEs create plausible deniability - they can claim it is the appraiser's responsibility to follow cert 5. AI-generated narrative can read as if a person wrote it. Yet it follows certain patterns, and the content loops back on itself to reach a bland "conclusion" in order to remain generic. A number of other fields and professions are using review oversight programs to check for AI "cheating"

We can predict the outcome. With the lax oversight, some appraisers will let AI do it all. Then the GSEs can say well if AI is virtually doing all the work, then who needs the appraiser? An anlysist can run the AI on 3.6

This was a strategic plan. When the GSEs started referring to appraisals as a "risk management tool", rather than the purpose they are designed for (MV opinion for a lending decision), the GSEs could run their own stats and conclude there is no risk management difference in a WAIVER. That was enough to convince the regulators.It would be a short step from there to convince regulators the same risk management applies with AI.

I tried to warn people on the board -when appraisers used to say that MV should be a range and not a point value, I warned them that if the appraiser does not pick the point value, then somebody else will- which is what happens in a waiver- the GSE runs an AVM range, and the lender client picks a point value for the property.The appraisers who kept whining about how they were not "good enough" to pick their own point value opened the door to this.

 

[Airstream]

We have had AVM’s for a considerable time now. On our local MLS it has a place for an AVM range of value. It gives the high and low value. It is surprisingly accurate in most cases. The AVMs will start using AI more and my guess they will become more accurate. The real issue is the input into the model. By that I mean getting someone to accurately inspect the subject property. That can easily happen.

What the 3.6 does is simply give us more data collection that can be put into models. Why else would we be asked to measure ceiling heights? I have yet to see ceiling heights mentioned much in MLS data. Or how about the height of the front door from the ground? Why? The answer is the AVM models will soon be collecting all that data and using it in the future.

I’m not saying appraisers will be gone…but the role may change. We will move into data collectors and making sure that AVMs have accurate information to crunch data.

As to the certifications….I think in the long run they will be out dated.

 

[Non Sequitur]

Fwiw,

If you have a old tablet, get a new one. It will not work on older tablets. My tablet has been glitchy when using the sketch.

Went out to practice the new uad 3.6 on my tablet...saved it and then bam. Could no longer open up mobile for total. It would crash and freeze.

Apparently you need a 15 and up version.

If you are a andriod person, costco has last year version 300 off. Last year model has the wide screen rear camera. The newer version does not.

The only iPad that has LiDAR and ultra-wide lenses is the 4th gen Pro from 2022. Don't be fooled by the current wide angle lense spec, we need ultra-wide. And the 4th gen is no longer made, you will have to buy used or refurbished on eBay. The latest Pro's have LiDAR but the camera lenses suck. I can't tell you how many appraisers I've talked to who bought the latest and greatest iPad Pro and are disappointed in the camera, and they ain't cheep. My advice: Eat the frog now and learn to use LiDAR sketching on the iPhone so you aren't jumping back and forth between devices, or just wait for a possible camera solution later down the line.

 

[Non Sequitur]

...snip...

1.Appraisal files will basically go away. There will be nothing to put in them except the order form and a purchase contract. All the “data” and “support” will be uploaded to the report automatically. Which leads to:
2. Appraisers will do a lot less appraising and more just reviewing. There will be a point where appraisers will forget how to actually appraise. They won’t realize it or even care; until they are called to the carpet and have to defend in appraisal in court or an audit. They won’t know how to explain their work and it won’t matter, anyway, because they don’t have an appraisal file.

From what I understand, yes to both. The only software provider I've heard address the work file situation is AIVRE. Per Jake his software tracks every process and creates a downloadable work file for the appraiser.

 

[NC Appraising]

The only iPad that has LiDAR and ultra-wide lenses is the 4th gen Pro from 2022. Don't be fooled by the current wide angle lense spec, we need ultra-wide. And the 4th gen is no longer made, you will have to buy used or refurbished on eBay. The latest Pro's have LiDAR but the camera lenses suck. I can't tell you how many appraisers I've talked to who bought the latest and greatest iPad Pro and are disappointed in the camera, and they ain't cheep. My advice: Eat the frog now and learn to use LiDAR sketching on the iPhone so you aren't jumping back and forth between devices, or just wait for a possible camera solution

100% agree.

I tried going crapple last year. They suck.

Either way I'm now screwed. The newer Samsungs got rid of the lidar like function. So can't use cubicasa. They also got rid of wide rear camera.

Just got back from costo.went with the 13". How does your old arse use a iPhone? Lol.

My solution for the camera. Will update when it comes in

iOgrapher Wide Angle Lens 37mm — Compatible with iOgrapher Lens Clip and Older iPad Cases

See more in every shot. The iOgrapher 37mm Wide Angle Lens expands your field of view so you can capture athletic events, full classrooms, conference footage, landscapes, and any scene too big for your standard camera lens. This lens mounts via the iOgrapher Lens Clip (for use with any phone or...

www.iographer.com

 

[J Grant]

UAD 3.6 does not require a LIDAR-generated sketch (which is more of a floor plan). We can draw a sketch using any sketch program

I asked tech support - on a mobile app, we can draw a rectangle, put in room labels, then click on a room label and the app will place the photos in there. Then we can sketch in detail back at our home office (if we want to). My iPhone screen is small, so that is what I plan to do.

If the GSE's require a lidar sketch in the future, I would have to upgrade my phone or get a lidar-enabled iPad or tablet (my iPhone does not have the LIDAR camera lens)

 

[NC Appraising]

Im waiting for
1. Lidar on ipad....not buying the accuracy. Sorry, if I come in low and my cubicasa ended up being 400 sqft off...just happened a month ago....how many lenders would drop you? I don't think they would give rats butt if you blamed the software...

2. See below. Anybody more tech savy than I? Can they be used with any of the currently available software TO IMPROVE the accuracy? Maybe you do not need a tablet or a iphone with lidar? Scan to sketch or cubicasa?

3. Still waiting for a cubicasa like program where i can edit and adjust right away.

FJ Dynamics Trion V4e LiDAR Kit | 3cm RTK Smartphone Scanner

Compact RTK-enabled LiDAR kit with 3 cm accuracy, 154,600 pts/sec, and 50 m range for indoor and outdoor 3D scanning and mapping.

precision3dworks.com

Raven LiDAR Scanner

Master complex field mapping and design with the 3DMakerpro Raven LiDAR. A rugged, ultra-portable 3D scanning solution delivering HD color point clouds anywhere.

store.3dmakerpro.com

SHARE C1 3D Spatial Camera

High-accuracy personal 3D LiDAR spatial camera for design and creative applications. Sub-centimeter point clouds, 70 m range, and a portable design for mobile spatial capture.

store.share3dcam.com

 

[Airstream]

Im waiting for
1. Lidar on ipad....not buying the accuracy. Sorry, if I come in low and my cubicasa ended up being 400 sqft off...just happened a month ago....how many lenders would drop you? I don't think they would give rats butt if you blamed the software...

Really. 400sq’ off is considerable. How big of a house? Ironically ANSI wants us to be to the nearest inch and all this scanning stuff is incredibly inaccurate then. Kind of a joke. I’m retired so I will just stick to the laser and doing the sketch.

FWIW I use an IPHONE, at least on most. If the house is going to be really big then may use the IPAD. Just don’t like the camera. I have been telling some people just get the biggest phone they can with a decent camera. I do realize some don’t like the small size of that either. To each their own. I looked at the IPAD mini, but that doesn’t have a decent camera either.