Stop Accepting Unreasonable Fees

[glenn walker]

Grok:

"Yes — that's unremarkable and fully permitted. A borrower can include a prior or independently-commissioned appraisal in the package they submit to the lender with a loan request, alongside pay stubs, tax returns, and everything else. There's no rule against a borrower giving the lender information, and it becomes part of the loan file.

The thing to keep clear is what sending it to the lender does and doesn't set in motion. It does not substitute for the loan appraisal — the lender is still required to order its own through the independent channel, and can't adopt yours. And the lender now inherits its own independence obligation: the production staff who receive your appraisal can't turn around and hand its value figure to the appraiser as a target, because the firewall the borrower is subject to also binds the lender. So "send it to the lender" doesn't quietly get your number in front of the appraiser as pressure — the lender is constrained the same way you are.

What it legitimately accomplishes is threefold. It's in the file, so it's on the record. The lender can, if it chooses, route the factual content — your comps, a corrected GLA, permit records — to its appraiser through the compliant channel as information. And most usefully, if the lender's own appraisal comes in low, your submitted appraisal is already sitting in the file as support for a Reconsideration of Value. So sending it with the application is permitted and sensible; just hold the accurate expectation that it arms a later dispute and supplies data, rather than steering the lender's appraisal from the outset."

Seems Grok replaced the need for your dream of those $650.00 fees you've been chasing....lol )

 

[Zee_in_AZ]

I know this won't be a popular take but no appraiser has EVER been forced to accept any particular fee. We know many have, and we all know why, but NO ONE on this forum is any different than the AMCs offering the pittance wages. They do so exactly because someone will accept them. Anyone here ever go to a garage sale? Ever haggle over a price? Ever try to talk the seller UP? You come to a mutual pricing decision. Oh by the way, why are buying that set of tools at a garage sale for $25 when you can get the same thing at Lowes for $375? Because you just need the quality of the $25 set that's why.

No friends, the AMCs are NOT the problem. I have stated that many times. The problem is the clients--banks, GSEs, and ultimately investors in the paper who are basically saying we don't care--we just want a number that supports the sales price. And since they are all willing to accept that, it will not take long for them to accept that number no matter how it comes about--AVM, seller or buyer stated value, dart board, monkeys, or AMC employees, er I mean independent contractors.

And there is nothing we can do about that. If they don't think knowing a true well-supported market value is important, they will not pay anyone $500, or $750 or more to develop this opinion of market value. They just don't care.

When you buy potatoes (or pick your favorite veggie), do you ask what kind of soil they were raised in, what farmer raised them and in what state, how long they were in sacks during transportation, etc? Maybe a very few care, but most don't. Do these things affect the taste and quality of a potato? Yep. Do you care? Nope. You gonna pay more for the highest quality potato? Nope. Hence most potatoes end up as commodities, with little to no price differences. That is where appraisals mostly are now. You may put together the best report with the best support, but no one cares anymore. If you still have clients that do, treat them like gold but do not plan your 2027 vacation around that income...

Very true, but we can control the narrative if people stop accepting the low fees. The problem is AMCs have preyed on the desperation of many appraisers and for whatever reason we have people accepting $250 for 1004s. I guess there are ambulance chasing attorneys, so if you can live with it, why not I guess.

 

[Zee_in_AZ]

Mortgage demand is low and AMCs have us by the....they are in control. Dart and Solidifi allegedly has both came out to say that they will not be increasing fees. The you have the appraisal foundation that are flooding the market with fog a mirror appraisers.

No offense, but when you have large firms that can knock out appraisals in 2-4 hours it becomes a volume game. It will get even worse with AI appraisals.
Unfortunately with high volume equates to lower fees.

What's worse, turn times is one of the main factors for getting more orders.

So if an AMC is in use, who is the AMC going with?

They get $600 for an order....they find a churn and burn firm that does them for $300 with a turn time of 2 days.

There are too many firms that are in the business to just make money. They could care less about the profession itself.

Go and protest outside of the appraisal foundation office. They are the ones that are crumbling the profession in the name of ideology with a oversupply of appraisers.

I wish I cared enough to protest. The industry is too far gone and there are too many idiots out there thinking $300 is acceptable for all the BS we have to endure. Best bet is now to find something else because this industry is doomed with FannieMae.

 

[glenn walker]

Very true, but we can control the narrative if people stop accepting the low fees. The problem is AMCs have preyed on the desperation of many appraisers and for whatever reason we have people accepting $250 for 1004s. I guess there are ambulance chasing attorneys, so if you can live with it, why not I guess.

You keep talking about $250-$300 fees but their order to you was at $385.00 then you rejected it and asked for $100.00 more.

My guess is someone else accepted the $385 but my point is it seems your getting orders for more money then your competition if there's are only $250-$300.

 

[RCA]

I wish I cared enough to protest. The industry is too far gone and there are too many idiots out there thinking $300 is acceptable for all the BS we have to endure. Best bet is now to find something else because this industry is doomed with FannieMae.

It's a racket more or less controlled by the AMCs. Do you know some typical AMC managers? You know what kind of people some are? They are like back-alley hoodlum bosses. The worst of the worst with street smarts, muscle, and guns. Back-alley. Often, if not usually, pot-belly fat, chain-smoking, mobster types. Worst of the worst. Some are drug addicts, and worse. Often they drop out of the racket and spend the rest of their life in some hole with pot and *****s and booze. They are the worst of the worst. And if you occasionally find a preacher who runs an AMC, he is probably on H. --- And for some out there, THAT should send shudders up their back and shivers down their spine. I know, I've seen some things.

There are much better lines of business to be in.

 

[Overimprovement]

Very true, but we can control the narrative if people stop accepting the low fees. The problem is AMCs have preyed on the desperation of many appraisers and for whatever reason we have people accepting $250 for 1004s. I guess there are ambulance chasing attorneys, so if you can live with it, why not I guess.

"We" ARE controlling the narrative because every assignment accepted for lower than what you or I think is reasonable are as much a part of "we" as we are. The number of appraisers who think is $300 is now a reasonable fee far outnumbers those who don't. The fact is we are part of the wrong "we"

 

[glenn walker]

If their mostly accepting $300.00 then unfortunately that's become the C&R in that market area and if your in say Phoenix Metro theres no shortage of hungry appraisers.

 

[Dublin ohio]

"We" ARE controlling the narrative because every assignment accepted for lower than what you or I think is reasonable are as much a part of "we" as we are. The number of appraisers who think is $300 is now a reasonable fee far outnumbers those who don't. The fact is we are part of the wrong "we"

Take Class for example. They probably do over 150K appraisals in a year. Obviously, a large number of appraisers are accepting their low fees on a regular basis

 

[glenn walker]

In large high density markets appraisers became a commodity that's traded like any other service or product and the value is buying the licensees signature and E&O insurance. Prior to interweb and online data the appraisers held control of the access to data.

The same things happened to attorneys and even medical doctors people have acess to data which in the past nobody but the provider had available.

 

[glenn walker]

C & R is the standard of what quality clients pay, not that set by bottom feeders.

Define Quality Clients ?
If you mean the ones that pay the highest fees that's not found in Dodd Frank or in the definition of C&R and in fact many appraisers at that time realised that implementing C&R was a banker's trap leading to lower fee's not higher ones.

The folk's that were supposed to be working for their appraisers dropped the ball and what was passed as law was really just a suggestion and not enforceable .