ANSI Question regarding a one story home

[sputnam]

Research GX001, that is what I have used in a similar situation.

Exactly.

 

[J Grant]

I would include all SqFt in the GLA and explain your reasons. ANSI is not absolute. If you go strictly by ANSI this house would not be eligible for any type of mortgage transaction since it would have no kitchen or bathroom. Use common sense. What would the average buyer expect and how common is this in the market? Would buyers even know the difference between 6'10" and 7' ceilings? You might want to inform the lender before proceeding. Again, explain in the addendum what you did.

sorry but ANSI is absolute for our profession now for GSE work. It is up to the lender what they loan on. We provide them with the information they need to make that decision

Regardless of whether most buyers would recognize difference between 6.10 and 7 feet, that is the cutoff point.

The house still has a kitchen and bath, it is on the sketch, but it is in the area of separate line item non GLA and explained.

BTW, many houses have a dropped ceiling and a higher roof line above. Removing the dropped ceiling would get the ceiling height higher going up to the beamed roof line. I wrote that as a possible cost to cure for a report I did with a similar problem - almost half the house had non GLA area it was 6.10 height but it got put on the grid as other useable space and adjusted for. I have no idea if the loan got done or not. (it was a refinance )

The lenders also got the memo about ANSI , I have no idea if it affects their lending decision, though technically it is not our concern. But the fact that it is a standard now means they might have gotten some guidelines on it as well .

 

[J Grant]

Research GX001, that is what I have used in a similar situation.

I don't believe gx0001 applies in that situation, the GX001 from my understanding reading it has a limited set of uses one being you could not enter the property, another about being on a slope -

 

[J Grant]

The house I did recently, which was very similar problem two of the comps in photos had low ceilings, however, like my subject the low ceilings were not in all areas. Without inspecting comps it would be impossible to guestimate what % of them were under 6.10. So I used the total sf of the comps but explained they had low ceilings in part, and because I put the subject bonus sf as a line item adjustment the values ended up similar as adjusted.

I also found a very small sf house with a guest house and the small sf of the main dwelling bracketed my subject.

ANSI has made it more difficult in cases like this but consider one of the reasons ANSI is required is because of cases like this- perhaps lenders got tired of loaning on properties only to find out later half the house was low ceiling or in an attic area-or more likely, the lenders did not care but the investors who bought the loans do. Somebody noticed it as enough of a problem to impose ANSI, so now appraisers are trying to get around ANSI? Apply ANSI as written, the appraisal will come out how it comes out, explain it was done that way because of the ANSI requirement.

 

[ucbruin]

The house I did recently, which was very similar problem two of the comps in photos had low ceilings, however, like my subject the low ceilings were not in all areas. Without inspecting comps it would be impossible to guestimate what % of them were under 6.10. So I used the total sf of the comps but explained they had low ceilings in part, and because I put the subject bonus sf as a line item adjustment the values ended up similar as adjusted.

I also found a very small sf house with a guest house and the small sf of the main dwelling bracketed my subject.

ANSI has made it more difficult in cases like this but consider one of the reasons ANSI is required is because of cases like this- perhaps lenders got tired of loaning on properties only to find out later half the house was low ceiling or in an attic area-or more likely, the lenders did not care but the investors who bought the loans do. Somebody noticed it as enough of a problem to impose ANSI, so now appraisers are trying to get around ANSI? Apply ANSI as written, the appraisal will come out how it comes out, explain it was done that way because of the ANSI requirement.

"ANSI has made it more difficult in cases like this but consider one of the reasons ANSI is required is because of cases like this- perhaps lenders got tired of loaning on properties only to find out later half the house was low ceiling or in an attic area-or more likely, the lenders did not care but the investors who bought the loans do. Somebody noticed it as enough of a problem to impose ANSI, so now appraisers are trying to get around ANSI? Apply ANSI as written, the appraisal will come out how it comes out, explain it was done that way because of the ANSI requirement."

I guess decade after decade of having human appraisers inspect properties may have muddied the waters more than helped....
Imagine human appraisers looking for ways to "get around ANSI"....
"Heavens to Murgatroyd!"

"Where have you gone, Joe DiMaggio?
Our nation turns its lonely eyes to you
Woo, woo, woo
What's that you say, Mrs. Robinson?
Joltin' Joe has left and gone away"

JG....
I'm just messing around....

 

[J Grant]

I would simply do the ANSI way, then explain in the grid how I am going to lump both together and adjust at the same SF. The fact I describe the house per ANSI, does not mean ANSI or FNMA is going to require I dissect the comps. Simply remark that since both are treated as the same as if GLA, the adjustment in the grid combines the non-GLA and GLA ANSI SF for purposes of comparison. It would be rather ridiculous to adjust down $65,000 on one line, the adjust back up $59,000 on another.

Wrt GSE fannie freddie work -.

We CAN NOT , or the subject "simply do it the ANSI way" and then lump the sf both together in the grid, because doing it the ANSI way requires appraiser to NOT lump the sf under 7 foot ceiling . It must be reported on a spearte line. (for the subject ). It is more work to adjust the SF one line and then a separate non ANSI compliant sf area on the other line but that is the requirement.

We might not be able to apply ANSI to the comps and we are not required to apply it to the comps, but we are required to apply ANSI to the subject.

 

[shrubberyvaluation]

The problem is you probably can't tell for the comps. Most likely you are just going to have wild adjustments that cancel each other out. I would use the exception and explain. When you take floor coverings into account that 6'10" will probably be even closer to 7 feet.

 

[djd09]

cert 23 makes everyone either an intended or unintended user, and no market participants uses ansi, not even desktoppers or waivers and maybe hybrids, why? because it is junk

 

[CGinMN]

Sometimes appraisers consider adjustments for site on a net basis, and I wonder if that is how this can be dealt with. For example, when comparing a home on a typical site to a home with a superior location but smaller site, sometimes the net impact is that no adjustment is necessary. Rather than make upward adjustments for GLA, and downward adjustments for non-GLA area, just adjust for the net impact on the GLA line and explain the reasoning in the comments. CU might not like it, but whatever…

 

[J Grant]

The problem is you probably can't tell for the comps. Most likely you are just going to have wild adjustments that cancel each other out. I would use the exception and explain. When you take floor coverings into account that 6'10" will probably be even closer to 7 feet.

We are not expected to use ANSI for the comps, we are expected to use it for the subject.
If the "wild adjustments" cancel each other out then the value comes out the same as it would have without those big adjustments. Big adjustments result from applying ANSI in these oddball cases but that is what the GSE's require so we are providing it to them.