Contract Date Versus Recorded Date

[SmilingDog]

I just got off the phone with Win2Data.

The "recording date" is REALLY THE SALE DATE! The "Sale" date they show is the "contract date" when there was a "meeting of the minds".

I'm not sure about other states, but here in Southern California the recording is done pretty instantly, and you get you "keys to the house" right after it records. The house is not yours until it records. Therefore, the "sale" is when the escrow closes, the deed is recorded and you get the keys.

I verified this with 2 properties I have personally bought in the last 12 months. Win2Data is pulling a "sale" date that is not accurate and is a really a contract date.

I'm having my attorney verify this as well. Win2Data's error in the way they present their data is misleading and could cause major disagreements. I report the recording date as I feel this is when the transaction was FINAL.

 

[Bill Wintermyer]

Chris

Or if can convince the agent on the transaction I have them fax me the HUD-1 sheet from the closing.

Gasp, choke, OMG.... Is the response I get every time I ask a builder/developer who does not put any development information into the local MLS.. YOU don't have the right to that information, go to the courthouse like everyone else, its public information!! Well says I, I sure can do that, and take the time out to knock on the doors of all the owners and ask them personal information about the purchase of their home. Well good says they... Good says I... Oooohhhh by the way, I notice your to settle in 30 days, I don't think that is going to happen... Why says they... For me to comb through all those county tax records and interview all the homeowners will be at least 6 - 8 weeks...

Fax machine goes crazy for some reason....

 

[Don Orttenburger]

I see some confusion here.

First American does not have access to contract dates or Pending dates, thats only avalible through the MLS or parties knowledgable about the transaction, only the date on the deed when the deed was delivered to the buyer and the date it was recorded are public record. In Michigan a deed only has to be delivered and NOT recorded to be valid and in some counties like Wayne County the delay may be 6 to 9 months for recording.

So the earlier date when the deed was delivered ie:closing is the sale date for appraisal purposes, not when and if it was recorded.

 

[Chris Colston]

I agree with Don....someone at F.A.R.E.S. doesn't know what they are talking about. (wouldn't be the first time considering they lost a payment check I sent them 2 checks 1 envelope, 1 check clears the other is lost in the cosmos... But that's another story). They do not have access to MLS info, and what about FSBOs?? F.A.R.E.S, doesn't have access to the contract date when the sale is "By owner". Nope...it's date of title transfer and date recorded in the court house.

 

[Ben Vukicevich SRA]

George,

The date of sale is the date it closes....however, the date of contract is important to know as that's when the sale price was set. If it lags too much, the sale may be non-useable.

For instance, I'm doing some new construction appraisals right now that were contracted in 2002 prior to approvals being granted. They are now closing over 1.5 years later in an appreciating market. Although they are recent sales, they don't reflect the current market. In that instance, the appraiser may choose to ignore the sales or to apply a time adjustment from the date of contract.

Ben

 

[Big ole Boy]

Sale date = the second after all monies have been transferred.

Everything else is smoke and mirrors. :lol:

This includes all payment methods.

Key here is who is doing the financing?

Sale date means different things with different payment methods.

Recording date is the first date the 'general public' and fast abstract researchers are aware.

Cash moves more quickly in our economy than all other legal tender - 'cash sale date is the 'sale date' we should focus on.

"the second after all monies have been transferred." :lol:

 

[SmilingDog]

Still doesn't explain why the seller will not give you the "key" to the house until it records!

For example: I bought a house in 2002. The escrow closed when deed was recorded on 12/10/2002, I had funds wire transferred only 48 hourse before, so there was no money changing hands. Yet FARES Win2Data shows sale date as 11/27/2002?????????????????????????? I swear that I could not move into this house until 12/10!!!!. Therefore the CLOSE OF SALE is the RECORDING DATE?

BTW - the contract date was sometime in May 2002 when we entered into contract and escrow was started (new home construction took 7 months to build).

So obviously I would not use the May 2002 date if this was a comp.

And I wouldn't use 11/27/2002 because NOTHING OCCURRED ON THAT DATE.

Sale date = date of possession on 12/10/2002. I'm having an attorney look into this... it's just too ambiguous as far as I can tell. Win2Data already has said that their "sale date" is the contract date or some other abstract date received from assessor's office.

 

[Big ole Boy]

Possession dates can always be 'sales contract specific' which is not a public document - only the deed is.

People can extend possession date for all sorts of reasons .... including those activily involved in a red hot real estate market. Possession allows time for some massaging of partipants.

I would think possession date lenghtens in high turn over markets. (especially sellers market).

 

[Ben Vukicevich SRA]

George,

You get the key at closing in NJ...

Ben

 

[Don Orttenburger]

Ben

Likwise in Michigan unless the seller has extended possession via contract. I think though some of us are reading to much into this, as long as we use a uniform date such as when money changes hands and the deed is delivered we are ok. I don't mean to diminish the importance of analysis of contract date vs closing if it's unusualy long, I just don't want to see a Tower of Babel regarding sale dates.