GSE Waiver & Data Collection Data

[George Hatch]

The appraiser's assignment does not include a request for an inspection of any type and the appraiser's SOW does not include an inspection of any type.

Same as any other desktop assignment.

But hey, if you think you can persuade the state board otherwise then by all means, knock yourself out.

 

[glenn walker]

How many appraisals have you done this month?

When’s the last time you read USPAP? If appraisers paid danny enough, he’d be arguing our side with plenty of USPAP bull**** to back him up.

Some folks are for sale to the highest bidder.

Actually I was just reading USPAP last night but reading it and comprehending it are separate issues. I find you often get GSE or Lender Guidelines confused with USPAP.

In all fairness that's common for Loan Production Appraisers. I believed that a Physical Inspection was mandatory until about 1995- I had a property on the side of a Mountain.

I spoke with George Dell a MAI by phone. He said in Alaska and in rough terrain, how would you physically set foot on some properties ? I responded by Pack Mule or Helicopter and he said no in most cases no inspection.

Okay the Light Bulb Turned On.
That's why there are Extraordinary--Assumptions or is that a Hypothetical maybe choose both. Lmao

 

[DWiley]

Actually I was just reading USPAP last night but reading it and comprehending it are separate issues. I find you often get GSE or Lender Guidelines confused with USPAP.

In all fairness that's common for Loan Production Appraisers. I believed that a Physical Inspection was mandatory until about 1995- I had a property on the side of a Mountain.

I spoke with George Dell a MAI by phone. He said in Alaska and in rough terrain, how would you physically set foot on some properties ? I responded by Pack Mule or Helicopter and he said no in most cases no inspection.

Okay the Light Bulb Turned On.
That's why there are Extraordinary--Assumptions or is that a Hypothetical maybe choose both. Lmao

As is well documented, the USPAP has never required an inspection. The reason it ever became a requirement was because users required it. And that was mainly because there was no other way to get the data needed, Things have changed. There are other ways to get the relevant data, and some users no longer require it in certain circumstances.

 

[Mejappz]

The issue in Florida is not whether USPAP requires a personal inspection—it does not—but whether a licensed or certified appraiser can credibly and legally rely on property data collected by a third party whom they neither hired nor supervised. Under Florida Statute § 475.612, any work used as the basis for an appraisal report must be supervised and approved by the appraiser who signs the report and assumes full responsibility. If the appraiser has no oversight of the property data collector—particularly when hired by an AMC—there is no legal or professional basis to claim supervision. This arrangement may violate Florida law and expose the appraiser to disciplinary action. While Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae may permit such practices under certain conditions, those investor guidelines do not override Florida’s licensure statutes or the appraiser’s obligations under USPAP. In Florida, accepting third-party data without meaningful supervision creates legal, ethical, and professional risk.

 

[gregb]

As is well documented, the USPAP has never required an inspection. The reason it ever became a requirement was because users required it. And that was mainly because there was no other way to get the data needed, Things have changed. There are other ways to get the relevant data, and some users no longer require it in certain circumstances.

Yeah, loan officer just needs to ask the home owner or the listing agent what exists and estimate value backed by an AVM, so no need for an appraiser any more. GSE's will take any loan offered to them, regardless of risk.

 

[George Hatch]

The reason the unlicensed runner is a different situation is because of the lie that's being told in the 1004 cert. The appraiser asserted in the 1004 that they performed their own personal inspection. If they didn't personally do what they said they did then certifying otherwise becomes the lie.

Not all assignments include that particular item in their certification. If the assignment didn't require the appraiser to personally inspect then them disclosing they didn't inspect is all it takes to comply.

 

[George Hatch]

The issue in Florida is not whether USPAP requires a personal inspection—it does not—but whether a licensed or certified appraiser can credibly and legally rely on property data collected by a third party whom they neither hired nor supervised. Under Florida Statute § 475.612, any work used as the basis for an appraisal report must be supervised and approved by the appraiser who signs the report and assumes full responsibility. If the appraiser has no oversight of the property data collector—particularly when hired by an AMC—there is no legal or professional basis to claim supervision. This arrangement may violate Florida law and expose the appraiser to disciplinary action. While Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae may permit such practices under certain conditions, those investor guidelines do not override Florida’s licensure statutes or the appraiser’s obligations under USPAP. In Florida, accepting third-party data without meaningful supervision creates legal, ethical, and professional risk.

I'm familiar with the argument. It just seems internally inconsistent (to me, anyway). You're alleging there exists unconditional responsibility for this particular source of information, which is inconsistent with the *standard assumption* we have always cited for all other 3rd party sources of information .





The appraiser had zero part in the origination of this information, which the same zero part they had in the origination of data from any other source they are using. You're not responsible for the error in the public records or the MLS or the title report or the termite report or in the rent roll or the income/expenses or the plans/specs, etc.

Like I said, the FL board operates off of state law, so maybe the argument will resonate with a judge. But if I were on the other side of that hearing I'd be making reference to the appraiser's own SOW and the users documented expectations of the appraiser SOW for that assignment. If the state is going to allege misconduct I'd put one or more of the state board members on the stand to directly acknowledge the documented facts of the assignment. Start at the beginning and work my way through to the end. If they don't know exactly what they're talking about they're going to be having a bad day on the witness stand.

 

[glenn walker]

As is well documented, the USPAP has never required an inspection. The reason it ever became a requirement was because users required it. And that was mainly because there was no other way to get the data needed, Things have changed. There are other ways to get the relevant data, and some users no longer require it in certain circumstances.

From a liability position the physical inspection is often the appraisers biggest liability. This is because so often that appraiser, states thing's he observed as factually being correct, when he or she has no training in construction and over steps their visual observation only and becomes a home inspector.

The attorney's used to tell us the safest appraisal assignment is the Exterior Only Drive Bye, because, everyone who reads the Certification knows your limitations.

The biggest damages I've personally witnessed in court cases were those where the appraiser "Stated as Fact A Roof Needed Replaced, or other Physical Conditions, were beyond repair and required new replacements.

In Summary: The typical appraiser is at best trained, to only have "observed " a Condition or something, that may require, Inspection by Appropriate Professional.

 

[gregb]

I'm familiar with the argument. It just seems internally inconsistent (to me, anyway). You're alleging there exists unconditional responsibility for this particular source of information, which is inconsistent with the *standard assumption* we have always cited for all other 3rd party sources of information .

View attachment 100196
View attachment 100197


And I'd put one or more of the state board members on the stand to directly acknowledge the facts of the assignment. If they don't know exactly what they're talking about they're going to be having a bad day on the witness stand.

When was the last time or ever time you did this? Or do you have any examples of this occurring any where any time in any court involving any appraiser in any state?>

 

[djd09]

All those unlicensed people out there now performing appraisal services. Quite amazing when you think about it. All pushed by folks whose licenses require them to uphold the public trust. no idea how appraisal organizations allow them to keep their designation or appraisal boards Allow them to keep their licenses.

A real low quality profession run by real low quality individuals at the top.

they aint following USPAP...can you blame them