Is a Bedroom lacking a closet not a bedroom?

[PropertyEconomics]

Attaching an armoire wouldn't make it a bedroom unless it's built in and basically a permanent part of the structure.

That is certainly not true in my market where many homes are in excess of 100 years old, many of which do not have closets but use armoires as the means of clothing storage. I dare youd not tell the owner of a 100 year old hacienda that has five bedrooms with no closets the he has no bedrooms.

The market dictates what a bedroom is not some one passing judgement on how people live ... its the ultimate of hypocricy .... its frankly no ones damn business. If it functions as a bedroom, and its used as a bedroom, and potential buyers would use it as a bedroom .. its a bedroom in my market.

 

[fifteen]

Whoa PE, lol, we're not talking 150+/- yr old dwellings that didn't have closets to begin with. People had one set of clothes for everything then, church, work, barn dances. They cleaned up by rubbing dirt all over themselves and then jumping in the river while maidens singing hymns on the shore beat out the dirt with large fronds. Tough folk. They didn't need closets. Typical for the era bedrooms were the size of prison cells, just used for sleeping. No room for a closet.

Closets have been around since, what the 20' or 30's? If you're comparing homes with closets then not having one means it's not a bedroom. What typical "comparables" have dictates the market reactions with or without.

So to compare a 125 yr old 3 bdrm dwelling with 60 year old 3 bdrm comparables that have closets, then yeah there wouldn't be an adjustment for the bedrooms but I would adjust for the added construction costs of a closet, most likely as a functional condition. Same goes with a 4 bedroom home that only has 3 with closets - especially if it's a predominately 4 bedroom market. Either adjust for the 4 bedrooms (with a function adjustment to reflect the lack of a closet) or adjust for the 3 if you can find a 3 bedroom comp to bracket. Guess what, the adjustment for the 3 to 4 would probably be the cost to install a closet.

That is certainly not true in my market where many homes are in excess of 100 years old, many of which do not have closets but use armoires as the means of clothing storage. I dare youd not tell the owner of a 100 year old hacienda that has five bedrooms with no closets the he has no bedrooms.

The market dictates what a bedroom is not some one passing judgement on how people live ... its the ultimate of hypocricy .... its frankly no ones damn business. If it functions as a bedroom, and its used as a bedroom, and potential buyers would use it as a bedroom .. its a bedroom in my market.

 

[Ken B]

Bedrooms without closets are still bedrooms, they just display functional obsolescence.

I recently appraised a property improved by a three bedroom house which had no closet in one bedroom, the side walls of the closet were there but there was no front wall or door. Since the house was recent construction I asked the owner why the closet wasn't finished. The owner told me that a three bedroom house would require a larger and much more expensive septic system so the building inspector suggested leaving the closet out and calling the house a two bedroom!

This scenario is not the same as that described in the OP.

In this case, the property is a two-bedroom property as that is its maximum legal use. If you call it a three-bedroom property and someone buys it as a three-bedroom property, you could wind up paying for that more expensive septic system. However, if you call it a two-bedroom property, a purchaser could use the "den/game room/hobby room/whatever-you-want-to-call-it-room" for whatever purpose they so desire.

 

[Ken B]

Whoa PE, lol, we're not talking 150+/- yr old dwellings that didn't have closets to begin with. People had one set of clothes for everything then, church, work, barn dances. They cleaned up by rubbing dirt all over themselves and then jumping in the river while maidens singing hymns on the shore beat out the dirt with large fronds. Tough folk. They didn't need closets. Typical for the era bedrooms were the size of prison cells, just used for sleeping. No room for a closet.

Closets have been around since, what the 20' or 30's? If you're comparing homes with closets then not having one means it's not a bedroom. What typical "comparables" have dictates the market reactions with or without.

So to compare a 125 yr old 3 bdrm dwelling with 60 year old 3 bdrm comparables that have closets, then yeah there wouldn't be an adjustment for the bedrooms but I would adjust for the added construction costs of a closet, most likely as a functional condition.

So I could construct a home today and for some whimsical purpose create an otherwise typical floorplan which just so happens to not have built-in closets in what would in every other similar property be considered the sleeping areas of the house and you would not call those rooms "bedrooms?"

 

[BlackLabs]

I recently appraised a $2MM beach house with 3 bedrooms because of septic system restrictions. However, it had three other rooms with closets that were not considered bedrooms (office, playroom and library - all with beds).

 

[cemoody]

Thought you might like to hear about the response from the Brevard County MLS, the Melbourne Area Association of Realtors (MAAR). I talked with the MLS administrator and was informed that their MLS had a ruling that any room without a closet could not be called a bedroom. A Realtor not getting the listing was believed to have called the MLS administrator about this listing and it was subsequently changed from a 3BR listing to a 2 BR. I asked the admin. if the homeowener could advertise an allowance for a closet in the listing and effectively allow it to be catagorized as a 3BR, much like you would advertise any proposed potential improvement, like new carpets etc. She said, "No". Then I offered that appraisers are generally trained with the idea that anything nailed, glued or attached to the land is considered real estate. I asked, "Would it be possible to attached a wardrobe to the wall of the bedroom and have it qualified as a 3BR?" "Bingo, she said, you are on to something there.

Once we attach the wardrobe or Chiffarobe, as she called it, the Brevard County MLS (MAAR) will allow us to advertise the dwelling as a 3 Bedroom. This is important because there is much more interest in the 3BR market for this size and quality of dwelling than in the two bedroom market. At least the homeowner will now get the traffic flow to allow the market to make up it own mind. It will be a great potential paired sale for some appraiser in the future, because the market will have been allowed to work.

 

[ValuMan]

Bedrooms without closets are still bedrooms, they just display functional obsolescence.

I recently appraised a property improved by a three bedroom house which had no closet in one bedroom, the side walls of the closet were there but there was no front wall or door. Since the house was recent construction I asked the owner why the closet wasn't finished. The owner told me that a three bedroom house would require a larger and much more expensive septic system so the building inspector suggested leaving the closet out and calling the house a two bedroom!

Loved that 2 bedroom fix.

Here we frequently find added attached or detached guest units to older SFRs, the added structures of which may or may not have been permitted - and there's frequently a big space in the kitchenette (where once a stove sat) so the appraiser won't know it is an illegal second kitchen. As soon as the appraiser leaves, back comes the stove and they think they've fooled 'em!

A guest unit can be legal if the structure is permitted and safe but NOT a separate stand alone (possibly rentable) unit - and only the stove is the determination of a kitchen. Even a microwave is OK plus full refrigerator. Just hide the stove (usually in plain site behind the building or in the garage, if that hasn't been converted into a four unit rental) .......just Kiddin', I think.

 

[Ron Runyon]

the market determines what is and isn't a bedroom....

I love to frolic in the river whilst maidens sing hymns...