July 2008 ASC Q&a- Wink Wink Comp Comp

[Lee Lansford]

Yet, they refuse to give us the tools to refute the "pressure".

They should say that comp checks are NOT allowed because the potential for abuse is just too great for the PUBLIC good.

Rice, I suspect that you resist the pressure as do many other appraisers. If I am correct in my assumption, you must possess the "tools to refute the 'pressure'."

The ASB can do "this" or "that" in response to your concerns and you know what? At the end of the day, the ethically-challenged (and, those who are just ignorant) will circumvent their best efforts.

Lee

 

[Lee Lansford]

...

The solution: Make all oral appraisal reports, except as ordered to be given under oath by a Judge, against the USPAP.

But...keep in mind that your solution will only affect those who choose to follow the rules.

 

[Fred]

Rice, the point is that when it comes to "pressure", the ASB does not control--the ASB does not have authority over--those who would "pressure" appraisers.

Right. The ASB is not Batman swooping in smite these Jokers in the mortgage business.

 

[George Hatch]

You can make comp checks and oral reports illegal and you might even be able to effectively stop them.

But that's not going to even touch your problem.


What'll you do then?

 

[Fred]

Yet, they refuse to give us the tools to refute the "pressure".

They should say that comp checks are NOT allowed because the potential for abuse is just too great for the PUBLIC good.

But what's a "comp check?" That's just a label, a bunch of words. I would like to see someone craft the language that bans "comp checks" that doesn't so cripple appraisal practice, that appraisers bound by those regs would be out of business. As I understand it, a comp check is someone asking an appraiser what a property is worth. Even if the ASB could ban such a thing, why would you want that. No one could ask an appraiser bound by USPAP, what property is worth.

Steve, I am not saying that the answer (or your's over the years) isn't the "correct" answer vis a vie' USPAP. One CAN do comp checks and still be USPAP compliant if one has the fortitude and ethical backbone. I am saying that I wholeheartedly and 100% disagree with USPAP on this issue.

Comp Checks beget Guaranteed Values 99.9% of the time.

The solution: Make all oral appraisal reports, except as ordered to be given under oath by a Judge, against the USPAP.

Here is a perfect example of what I just referred to. If that were true, appraisers would not be able to converse ahead of time with the lawyer about the testimony, not be able to testify in mediation, not be able to consult with clients in many needed ways, or respond to follow up questions by clients like underwriters. The comp check doesn't beget the guaranteed value any more than the telephone, email or fax machine does begets them.

George is right. The state's have the power to make new regs.

Not for federal transactions. Anyone have a mulberry bush?

 

[George W Dodd]

State Appraisal Boards are limited to the regulation of Appraisers and their conduct. The Appraisal Boards must take an active role in establishing acceptable practices. This practice can be stopped by effective enforcement of existing rules & regs. The disappointment with the asb Q&As is the complete lack of any useful information.

 

[Fred]

The disappointment with the asb Q&As is the complete lack of any useful information.

Information about what?

 

[Mike Phillips]

If there is one argument that should be scrapped and never mentioned again, it is the argument that the states should do this or that. Yes, the states should do many things, but it ain't gonna happen for a variety of reasons, starting with - they don't have a dog in the enforcement fight. Never have.

The residential housing market is a national priority, not a state level priority. It should be regulated at the federal level.

I'll tell you what my state legislators care about -the voters. Not the citizens of the state of Florida - only those who vote. Needless to say, regulating appraisers, or the mortgage industry isn't at the top of the voter's lists. My observation is the Florida DBPR could care less what the ASC and certainly TAF think. The only thing that will make Florida regulate anything is being forced to do so.

Another thing I get sick and tired of hearing about - the fact that TAF has no authority to do this or that. They have the ability and the obligation to write appraisal standards for the good of the public, regardless of whether those standards are enforced or not. That's all I ask - they need to grow a pair of coconuts, get their noses out of the backside of the mortgage industry, learn to write clearly, and do the right thing. A document that is not understood by the people who rely on it is worthless. USPAP is damn near worthless.

TAF needs to go back to square one and define and discuss (in an appropriate level of detail, for once) exactly what the phrase "maintaining the public trust" means. Let's discuss (1) public, (2) trust and (3) maintining the public trust, IN THAT ORDER!!!

It would be helpful if TAF took the time to mention that the client is the entity with whom the appraiser has contracted - no less, but certainly no more. The appraiser is ultimately responsible to the public, to society and not the damn client. That is why the appraiser's product must be credible, regardless of what the client wants.

Last but not least let me state it is a damn crying shame that through this entire mees we haven't seen a single member of TAF stand up and offer an assessment, explanation or an apology for anything. I hope I remain in this vocation long enough to finally see a true activist emerge from TAF, one who is capable of commanding appraisers' respect because he (or she) demonstrates their determination to work in the public's best interest.

 

[Jim Onderisin]

The comp-check is not profitable to any but the most ethically-challenged appraiser. In such an appraiser's hands, it doesn't comply with USPAP and is only a means to ensnare business entrusted to a lender by unsuspecting (and suspecting) homeowners. In the hands of an ethical appraiser, it is a USPAP-compliant means of helping a lender assess "appraisal risk". My guess is that the comp-check has been employed by virtually every practicing appraiser for this purpose at one time or another.

The comp-check is a valid service allowed by USPAP. It is also a service which requires a high degree of honesty, ethics and commitment to the letter of the USPAP. Unfortunately, as has been stated many times in other threads and conversations between appraisers..."You can't legislate morality (or honesty or ethics)." Most times, comp-checks are abused rather than used.

Federal powers that be know exactly what is going on, but to outlaw this service outright would be to allow only unethical appraisers to provide it; the service would no longer be provided by appraisers seeking to "do the right thing" but would be the exclusive tool of abusers.

 

[OSU Beavers]

Just received an email (IMPORTANT MESSAGE FROM ACLB ADMINISTRATOR) referring to the ASB QUESTION/ANSWER just issued as how to proceed with problems appraiser may have with Comp Check and What happens to electronic reports.

Pam, I don't see a board (if OR which is generally proactive in this field) make a different decision, rather than deferring to the ASB.

Sorry, Comp checks are here to stay, Electronic signatures (as the OR Board all ready stated earlier last year) can and will be removed and appraisal altered. The only good thing is that now if we are limited only to the point of shipping the report.

OHIO has the no target value on the order LAW, why can't Oregon?