"legal Description" Phoenix, Az

[Ultraviolet]

Point is the assessor is not the only public record folks and if the recorder has it different you can know it. If the recorder and the assessor are different I definitely recommend siding with the recorder. Like Jo Ann pointed out, the more we write the greater the opportunity for scrivener's error.

I agree, Edd. But we were talking about legal descriptions, not ownership records. I always check the recorder for the subject, and report any differences. Of course the recorder is more current, and if a new legal has been recorded I scan it into the report.

but more often than not, the stated legal description is simply the neighborhood name like "Cavalier Foothills Unit One". Tax records also show the lot/blk, township, and block which i know better identifies the exact parcel.

so what is the "right" legal description to use?

The original question was about "how much of the legal" to report. I say all of it, according to public records (assessor or recorder - whatever is most current and relevant).

If a typical subdivision has been legally recorded for years and years, with no lot splits or resubdivision, the assessor's information is generally correct - in MY area, which is similar to George's. Long legals are a different animal, not related to the original question. The point is that the lot/block/township/block should be reported, not just the name of the subdivision.

Usually if there's a problem with the legal description it will be pretty clear at the outset and the need for further investigation is warranted. When the plat and legal match up through the assessor's recorded plat and property record card, that's what I report and simply state where I got my information.

 

[Julie Lee]

Dittos to what Jo Anne said. Lot, block & tract. If you have the prelim, scan a copy of the legal description as an addendum.

 

[xm72mhd]

Originally posted by Rae Saunders@Jan 2 2006, 11:39 AM

I agree, Edd. But we were talking about legal descriptions, not ownership records.

I know that! My contribution was intended to illustrate my experience that the assessor is not always correct.

So you want a war story restricted to title? OK, you asked for it. This is an appraiser war story.

Subject REO consisted of several adjacent parcels of land acquired at different times by the defaulting borrower. To add to the intrigue the places sat on the very edge of town and were described with different systems. The parcels in town were lot and block and the those outside were quarter-quarter and there was a vacated street in the mix with some wells and a vacated alley. So I drew it all out and guess what? The assessor had the house on the wrong legal and the client had used that in the deed of trust. That I was able to discover from observation without going to the clerks office. Now I reported that finding and explained it and the client fired me, because the client just didn't want to hear that. To CYA I sent them my write up anyway. Now one year + later the place is finally for sale "as is" with no takers at $35Kand no guarantee of title. Nice little house, more than TLC wear and tear, acre and a half, city water and sewer and paved access. Worth $90K or so if it had a title.

Another one. Unimproved platted sites. Bank description on assignment does not match the deed of trust and the assessor and title company do not agree with the recorded deed and the recorded deed does not agree with the plat. So what to do? This stuff happens a lot. It is usually resolved amicably, but who's supposed to discover it?

So the point is?

 

[Ultraviolet]

Another one. Unimproved platted sites. Bank description on assignment does not match the deed of trust and the assessor and title company do not agree with the recorded deed and the recorded deed does not agree with the plat. So what to do? This stuff happens a lot. It is usually resolved amicably, but who's supposed to discover it?

See, when there's a problem with the legal it will usually be pretty evident at the outset!

I think the original question was a lot (no pun intended :lol: ) simpler than we stubborn appraisers have made it out to be.

If I see evidence of a problem, I report it. If it's a simple legal description with all information matching up, I report it and say where I got my information.

War stories, hmm ... none of those around here !!!

I'm an appraiser, not a title expert, surveyor, or county employee!!! Report the available facts without omitting anything (or inserting your own opinion) and let the client sort out the problems.

 

[dblbogey]

Interestingly enough, I was tought to just put the deed book & Page in the blank. now I know that isn't the legal description, just the place to find it.

When I went on my own, I started putting the legal description. Guess what? The lender called to complain. They wanted the deed book & page.

 

[xm72mhd]

Originally posted by Rae Saunders@Jan 2 2006, 12:44 PM
See, when there's a problem with the legal it will usually be pretty evident at the outset!

I think the original question was a lot (no pun intended :lol: ) simpler than we stubborn appraisers have made it out to be.
employee!!! Report the available facts without omitting anything (or inserting your own opinion) and let the client sort out the problems.

I thought George asked which source of the legal description is correct one. 'course I know he was also asking which is the preferred description from among different systems of legal descriptions, but the answers to the question are not simple at all and it just won't do to excuse an error of this kind away with "I'm just an appraiser."

And in the second story I recited, the bank, the title company and the assessor had no clue until I got a copy of the deed from the recorder and took the time to compare what they all were saying with the plat. It wasn't obvious to me at all. I thought making sure I know what I am appraising and who owns it goes with the territory, or does it? And if I can't be sure, disclose it.

 

[Bill Baughn]

Originally posted by Phil Chamberlin@Jan 2 2006, 12:54 AM
Bill -

In CA, typically Lot & Tract, sometimes Lot, Block & Tract does constitute a complete legal description.

Phil,

But doesn't it also continue to say AS RECORDED IN BOOK zzz, PAGE zzz OF THE LOS ANGELES COUNTY RECORDS?


Bill Baughn

 

[Ultraviolet]

And in the second story I recited, the bank, the title company and the assessor had no clue until I got a copy of the deed from the recorder and took the time to compare what they all were saying with the plat. It wasn't obvious to me at all.

I'll bet this was a metes and bounds legal, right? And there was confusion among all parties involved? Different sources were saying different things and it was part of your job to discover the truth within the scope of the assignment.

There is a big difference in a subdivided legal and a long legal, that's my main point. It's very rare (at least in MY area) for a subdivided lot legal to be recorded or reported by the assessor incorrectly.

I am in no way saying that anyone should use "I'm just an appraiser" as an excuse for anything. But when I start stepping outside my role and doing anything besides reporting the facts as I've been able to discover them, I could be in a lot of trouble (and rightly so).

 

[Bill Baughn]

Originally posted by Rick Lipford@Jan 2 2006, 12:08 PM
Interestingly enough, I was tought to just put the deed book & Page in the blank. now I know that isn't the legal description, just the place to find it.

When I went on my own, I started putting the legal description. Guess what? The lender called to complain. They wanted the deed book & page.

Rick,

The book and page are the last parts of the legal description, lot and tract are typically the first parts...


Bill Baughn

 

[xm72mhd]

Originally posted by Bill Baughn@Jan 2 2006, 02:09 PM
Phil,

But doesn't it also continue to say AS RECORDED IN BOOK zzz, PAGE zzz OF THE LOS ANGELES COUNTY RECORDS?


Bill Baughn

Just because it is on the deed does not make it a part of the legal description. That's just filing info. that book and page stuff. It has nothing to do with the property at all other than to tell you where to find the info.