MLS vs. Pub. Rec. prices, new scam?

[Walter Kirk]

Any time there is a discrepancy between the MLS and the public record you must investigate. After a while you learn who the liars are and what tricks are used. I know of one Realtor who never posts factual data. I never use a comp that this broker has had anything to do with. In short it might be better to find another comp.

 

[Mike Kennedy]

In this neck o' the woods, Assessors routinely actual sale price from Deeds/Transfers they receive from the County Recorder. 9 out of 9 times.......the variance has always required confirmation by BOTH listing and selling agents {and/or their Broker-owners}who when called will (either 1 or both) usually divulge Concessions not listed on the ML listing citing "sent the info to ML they must not have revised the listing to include the closing costs etc."

Yeah right.

I gotta Bridge in Brooklyn to sell ya.


p.s. just ONE more reason BPOs & AVhums.......will INFLATE values....fraudulently (and the users KNOW IT ).

 

[fifteen]

45% of all sales in January, across the nation, were distressed sales ! I know it's off-topic but I find that somewhat astounding.

Speak up - be heard!
http://appraisersforum.com/showthread.php?p=1773991#post1773991

 

[Richard Carlsen]

The ones I have seen make sense for the MLS to have the correct price. The one today was listed for $167,000 and sold through MLS for $156,000 with a 50 day marketing time. The $156,000 made sense, the sale was recorded at $176,000.

Personal property perhaps? Additional land? Side agreement not included in the broker prepared PA?

The sales price shown is normally taken from the deed and therefore the actual sales price of the transaction. The property sold for -6.5% of list in 50 days! I don't know about this market but 50 DOM up here indicates aggressive pricing. Check the docs closely and see if either personal property or possibly an additional lot was included in the sale.

I seriously doubt that anybody is out spending $175K just to establish a comp.

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

The $ difference was not out of/into anybody's pocket. The only $ cost is the State sales/recording tax/fees. That's a game that's been played for many years by developers, builders, investors, speculators. Recording a deed showing a higher than reality sale price is not new and is still happening.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

Verification is talking with someone associated with the sale

It could also be having a copy of the closing statement...I trust THAT.

In most states it is illegal to understate the sales price on a deed, but I don't know of any that make it illegal to buy documentary stamps for MORE than the sales price. Lawyers used to suggest to people wishing to hold property for short times (2 - 5 years) to buy additional stamps because buyers often look to see what was paid.

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

We've had developers and builders, etc., handing out false closing statements to appraisers here in FL. One that's real, and one for the appraisers.

 

[Mr Rex]

You want transparency? Make HUD 1's public data. It ain't rocket surgery folks.

 

[David Beasley]

You want transparency? Make HUD 1's public data. It ain't rocket surgery folks.

God wouldn't that be nice.

When we find a discrepancy between the deed revenue/sales price on the tax card and the closed price in the MLS for potential comps, often time the county's sales price is the higher of the 2.

When we call the agent or broker, 99% of the time they pull the HUD1 and confirm while we're on the phone (or do it and call us back), that the price they put in the MLS is correct. (The other 1%, we're told the MLS price is a typo, and is usually corrected the next time we see it in the MLS system.)

Apparently, and for whatever reasons, a lot of excise/tax stamps are being collected on the "asking price" and not the actual sale price. Anyone using those tax card-indicated prices is certainly using an inflated and false value for that comp's sale price. I'd say about 100% of the time, when there is an error found, the county indeed collected revenue based on the asking price.

The agents/brokers around here never seem to mind pulling the HUD1 from the file and telling us what it says. Some of them even offer to fax it to us (and we gladly accept every time). If we could make HUD1s readily available, man, that would be a huge leap in the right direction of sale verification.

 

[Mike Boyd]

Many 'investors' and 'speculators' have been doing this for years. They pay extra recording 'stamps' to show a higher price than reality sometimes to get higher than reality LTV mortgage or have a stake in other properties and want to produce 'comps' that are not based in reality. Sometimes the real estate agents are in on it, and sometimes not.

Avoid using any sales like this. If you MUST use a sale like this, use the MLS sale price stating that it was verified as the true sale price by the Realtor. Explain that the sale price as listed in the public records appears to be wrong and that you are using what you believe to be correct.

Report any sales you find like this at the Mortgage Fraud Watch List .org so that many of the mortgage fraud investigators, law enforcement, regulators, and lenders fraud departements will find it and hopefully do something about it.

I've seen it over many years, also. A borrower can request the title company or escrow holder to add more transfer tax dollars. Often, the real estate agent is not aware of this.