New Florida Condo Law

[jay trotta]

Just curious how Desantis new Condo Law has impacted that market? Reading here and there about Zombie Condo's in the wake of the Governor's new law and how little thought went into that decision.
I know there were limits on height & age, but eventually everything (Condo's) gets older each year.

 

[J Grant]

Just curious how Desantis new Condo Law has impacted that market? Reading here and there about Zombie Condo's in the wake of the Governor's new law and how little thought went into that decision.
I know there were limits on height & age, but eventually everything (Condo's) gets older each year.

I live here and I do not hear the term Zombie condos tossed around - I don't even know what it means.
The law, in effect a few years ago, followed the surfside collapse, with a mandatory engineer report for buildings 3 plus stories to be done every 40 -60 years, and that condos have a certain amount of reserves for repairs.

Overall IMO, it is a good law - an assessment is passed for repairs on a lump sum or paid over time. In some of the high or mid-rise buildings along the water, a structural engineer report can reveal a concrete restoration or structural repair in the millions, and some owners can not afford it, so they have to sell. In the past, they could refuse to do the repair and tie the building up for years in litigation and endanger everybody else - which was what happened in Surfside 98 people died because some owners did not have the $ for the assessment, so the work never got done.

wrt affected the market - I am not in Miami so can not comment on that market, in Palm Beach County I do not see an adverse impact. Overall, storm insurance's insane high rates have more of an impact because the HOA fees are not so high.

 

[jay trotta]

Former Republican state senator Jeff Brandes, who is also the current president of the Florida Policy Project, recently warned that these upcoming deadlines could force people into undesirable situations.
"It could end up leading to some pretty catastrophic outcomes where people are unable to raise the money to fund their required reserves by state law," he explained.

It is my understanding; those costs could be in the hundreds to thousands of dollars for buildings over 30 years old and over 4 stories tall, that is a lot of complexes. IMO-that should have been a "phase in" project over time and allow time for those increases. Well, the term Zombie has been noted in some online articles, I do not think that is good reporting, IMO.
For every problem there is a solution, but my point here is, politicians hardly ever consider the "collateral damage" they create by not thinking, just get the Bill/Law passed for PR purposes. Short sided in the long run.

 

[sputnam]

They have condos just for zombies? Isn't that discriminatory?

 

[J Grant]

Former Republican state senator Jeff Brandes, who is also the current president of the Florida Policy Project, recently warned that these upcoming deadlines could force people into undesirable situations.
"It could end up leading to some pretty catastrophic outcomes where people are unable to raise the money to fund their required reserves by state law," he explained.

It is my understanding; those costs could be in the hundreds to thousands of dollars for buildings over 30 years old and over 4 stories tall, that is a lot of complexes. IMO-that should have been a "phase in" project over time and allow time for those increases. Well, the term Zombie has been noted in some online articles, I do not think that is good reporting, IMO.
For every problem there is a solution, but my point here is, politicians hardly ever consider the "collateral damage" they create by not thinking, just get the Bill/Law passed for PR purposes. Short sided in the long run.

I think they consider it, but any law will be unpopular with some people. The fact is some people can not afford the condo they live in, and why should that compromise the safety of everyone else in the building? The person who can't afford it needs to sell then, and owners need to understand that like any dwelling, a condo ages and will need repairs, but in this case it is a collective decision.

 

[Tom D]

They have condos just for zombies? Isn't that discriminatory?

Not discrim. We have a zip code just for them. It's the highest drug use zip code in the usa. We prefer the term outside neighbors for the wobblers. Everyone needs a place to express their happiness.

I would think that with the hurricanes battering these buildings that they should be checked every so often. The when one falls over, they can't blame l&i for not inspecting them.
Don't want problems, don't live in the eye of the hurricanes. Although, miami was the only long vacation i took. It was christmas week when business was dead. Palm trees with perfect weather at christmas. My wife's aunt told us not to drive thru some areas while sight seeing.

 

[J Grant]

Not discrim. We have a zip code just for them. It's the highest drug use zip code in the usa. We prefer the term outside neighbors for the wobblers. Everyone needs a place to express their happiness.

I would think that with the hurricanes battering these buildings that they should be checked every so often. The when one falls over, they can't blame l&i for not inspecting them.
Don't want problems, don't live in the eye of the hurricanes. Although, miami was the only long vacation i took. It was christmas week when business was dead. Palm trees with perfect weather at christmas. My wife's aunt told us not to drive thru some areas while sight seeing.

In addition to the storms, what really gets these buildings on the coast and even inland if a high rise is the salt erosion from the air, which can eat away steel beams and even erode the integrity of concrete. Add i nshifgint sand around pilings and a shallow ground area - much of FL is only 7 feet above sea level. I cities like NYC they have natural limestone bedrock several hundred feet deep to sink the pilings into.

Probably in reality FL land was not meant for the kind of high rises they started building - people only found that out over time of course. They will last a long time if maintained but the maintenance isn;t cheap.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

In short, these Condos did not collect sufficient funds over the previous decades to fully fund their reserves. And to refill those reserves and properly test the building integrity required much higher fees than the occupants wanted to pay and management wanted to charge. Now they have to play catch up. Not good.

 

[ucbruin]

So many articles regarding rising condo insurance and HOA fees....
They all seem to be about condos located in coastal southern states....

 

[Mark K]

In the Midwest they shut down miles of highways at a time so they can tear them out down to the dirt and start over. Much of this is due to the salt they put on the roads in the winter. Concrete is porous and the salt water penetrates it and rusts out the rebar holding the road together. These are highways built in the 60's thru 80's. BTW, the new roads have epoxy coated rebar that's supposed to last longer.

The same thing is happening in FL with the salt corroding the rebar and steel beams in the condos. Some of these repairs are going to cost well into the $millions. That Surfside collapse is just the tip of the iceberg. It wouldn't surprise me if a lot of the older condo towers are razed due to either the cost of repairs or the inability to retrofit them safely.

Some of these condos are going to end up like many of the houses in Detroit and other places after the meltdown where a lot of people quit paying the mtgs and walk away. Like Detroit et.al., even the mortgage company won't want to take the condos back and the few that want to stay are going to end up saddled with the costs, if they can afford it.

Its going to get real ugly in some cases. Before Mom died suddenly I was looking at some condos in the Punta Gorda area a few years back. Some of those condos in the $300K range have reduced their asking price, a LOT, my guess is because the HOA fees have increased from $300+/- to over $900/month. Some of the more expensive ones, $500K +/-, have HOA fees in the $1,200 - $1,500 range to catch up on the reserve requirements. With the HOA fee increases, the increasing insurance premiums, taxes, and then a mtg payment, its getting pricy to live in Hurricane Alley.

On a side note, you have to wonder what the lenders are doing to protect their interests? Mandatory building inspections, building age limitations, HOA reserves analysis by a competent CPA, etc.?