No more MLS Photos

[BRCJR]

............................................................................................................................What happens if you drive up a long driveway and nobody is home? You gonna snap the picture anyways? Then what happens when you find out they were home and just did not want to answer the door, saw you take a picture on their private property, got your license #, called police and prosectuted you for trespassing? ..........................................................................................QUOTE]

You are not trespassing unless it is posted or you are asked to leave and you do not.

 

[Delta85]

See my other response regarding this activity. I'm not an attorney, but there is a fine line between illegal and legal trespass. For instance, meter readers don't ask for permission. Utility repair crews or surveyors either, even when "trespassing" on property other that than for which they are engaged.

How come? Because states, communities, and courts realize that there exist occasions which require such unfettered access. Knocking on someone's door to verify information is not illegal, especially in performance of an activity for which you are licensed by the state.

Once again you and I seem to have little in common. I would never advocate for someone to do anything for which they felt unsafe or otherwise at risk of life or limb. That said, many are simply too afraid to be nosy and ask total strangers questions, either because they've never been trained to do so, or because they believe it to be none of their business. What are these people even doing in this business?

It is the nature of this job to be inquisitive, to ask pointed questions at times, to engage total strangers, even those who appear different from us.

Again, appraisers are such wussies. Asking permission to take pictures is merely a way of being polite, a practice that most people appreciate and are tolerant of.

If one finds much hostility doing such verifications, they should work on their people skills.

PS. 38 years in this business and I've never once heard of someone being charged, let alone convicted or fined for trespass when performing an appraisal. Yet this group of cackling hens worries about it as though it's a frequent occurrence. My advice is to worry about things that really do happen and can actually hurt your careers and business, like being found negligent in the verification of your comp data, for instance.

I know it is not illegal, usually, to go and knock on a door and attempt conversation. I'm saying who needs the hassle?

It's not about being a "wussie". That's easy to say on a chat site. In many areas you get out of your car at your own risk. In some areas I'm nervous getting out of my car to go into the inspection....and these people are expecting me! Even in better areas you have a 50/50 chance of being refused the photo or questions. Why waste the time? Our due diligence requires us to view the property from the street. I'll attempt to do that if it is visible, if not I'll use an online photo and move on. If there are people out front I'll drive by and view the comp and use an online photo.

As I said in my previous post I've met good people and bad. But the bad people make me ask myself why bother with the hassle.

 

[BRCJR]

If the comp is in a gated community call a Realtor or find someone that can get you in the gate.

I have never been refused when taking the extra step and finding the "right" person.

I am glad I have never had to sign a certification saying I did something I did not do.

I just envision something such as this:

Attorney: You used a photograph other than original, is that correct?

Appraiser: Yes.

Attorney: Why?

Appraiser: I could not see the improvements because of impaired access or view.

Attorney: Why did you sign a certification, that you may not alter I might add (GSE), saying you did inspect the comparable from at least the street?

Your answers please............................just curious.

 

[Delta85]

............................................................................................................................What happens if you drive up a long driveway and nobody is home? You gonna snap the picture anyways? Then what happens when you find out they were home and just did not want to answer the door, saw you take a picture on their private property, got your license #, called police and prosectuted you for trespassing? ..........................................................................................QUOTE]

You are not trespassing unless it is posted or you are asked to leave and you do not.

Some people don't take kindly to trespassing and fail to hang a sign saying so. Also, homes with long driveways often have dogs roaming unleashed you may not be aware of until you find yourself knocking on a door with nobody home. Have fun getting back to your car.

There are a million things that can go badly. Why risk the hassle just to view and photograph a comp for a report at best you are being paid $350 to complete.

 

[Joyce Potts]

If you do not "inspect the comp from the street" how can you use it and sign a certification saying you did?

Just asking........I have always wondered about this practice in appraisal practice.

Point well taken and a horse that has been beat to death on this very Forum. While the certification cannot be changed, I certainly caveat why the comp couldn't be inspected from the street. Lets call it the common sense approach -- and let me also impart that years ago I once had an appraiser that was actually ARRESTED and PROSECUTED for sneaking in a construction entrance to get to a SUBJECT PROPERTY (Vacant) and COMPS.

True story, so pick your poison.

 

[Delta85]

If the comp is in a gated community and call a Realtor or find someone that can get you in the gate.

I have never been refused when taking the extra step and finding the "right" person.

For a comp? Are you kidding? Call a realtor to get you in? We can barely get realtors to call us back with comp info, let alone drive out and let us into a gated community.

What are the other options? Wait by the gate until someone comes or goes and sneak in? Ask them to let you in and tell them you are an appraiser who does not actually know anyone living in the gated community nor that you have an appointment with anyone? That is even assuming someone is there when you arrive and are willing to let a stranger into a gated community to roam about the grounds.

That's a lot of time spent on viewing a comp IMO. There are only 24 hours in my days.

 

[Vermonter]

It is not against the law to knock on someone's door to verify information. You are not selling, so you don't need a peddler's license. You are appraising, an activity for which the state has given you license.

In that circumstance, I defy you to demonstrate where a court anywhere in this country has held such activity to be trespass!

http://www.nhregister.com/articles/...oc4cce33b8e8cdb162115195.txt?viewmode=default

“Could they be arrested for simple trespass? Yes. Would we arrest them? No,” he said. Since the workers are generally “acting in good faith” by doing work for the city and collecting information to be used for tax assessments, police try to “work it out” by talking to the worker, he said.

You think the police would show the same discretion for a private appraiser working for a private bank on a different property than the one you're trespassing on?

Like I said, know your state laws and FOLLOW them.

 

[BRCJR]

For a comp? Are you kidding? Call a realtor to get you in? We can barely get realtors to call us back with comp info, let alone drive out and let us into a gated community.

What are the other options? Wait by the gate until someone comes or goes and sneak in? Ask them to let you in and tell them you are an appraiser who does not actually know anyone living in the gated community?

That's a lot of time spent on viewing a comp IMO. There are only 24 hours in my days.

Did not say a Realtor had to drive out and let me in. We have cell phones and have civil relationships. Plan ahead, if you did not know your comp was in a gated community..........well..........

 

[Delta85]

If the comp is in a gated community call a Realtor or find someone that can get you in the gate.

I have never been refused when taking the extra step and finding the "right" person.

I am glad I have never had to sign a certification saying I did something I did not do.

I just envision something such as this:

Attorney: You used a photograph other than original, is that correct?

Appraiser: Yes.

Attorney: Why?

Appraiser: I could not see the improvements because of impaired access or view.

Attorney: Why did you sign a certification, that you may not alter I might add (GSE), saying you did inspect the comparable from at least the street?

Your answers please............................just curious.

My answer would be that I did attempt to inspect from the street (photos of the long driveway or gate provided) and that it is extremely common for appraisers to use online photos when unable to view or photograph a comp. I'd then point to my comments in the report itself explaining what I did and why.

If that does not work then probably every appraiser has broken this law at one time or another and would be liable in court. So we should NOT use excellent comps just because there were trees blocking the photo or little kids playing in the front yard when we drove by?

 

[Delta85]

Did not say a Realtor had to drive out and let me in. We have cell phones and have civil relationships. Plan ahead, if you did not know your comp was in a gated community..........well..........

So on every report you do you call every realtor every time before snapping a picture? And then what? Is a realtor gonna arrange for you to get in? And if not, do you NOT use the comp simply because it is in a gated community? What if your subject is in another gated community?