Question on permits

[RCA]

Most repairs don't require permits. Upgrades often do... usually depending on the extent of the work.

Let's expand on that a bit.

In California (partially from Bard, but fits my knowledge, understanding and experience hiring workers to do work on my house):

1. Whether repairs require a permit depends on the nature of the repairs. Minor repairs that do not affect the house's structural integrity or change the use of space do not typically require a permit. Examples of minor repairs are:

• Painting
• Replacing shingles or roof tiles
• Repairing a leaky faucet
• Replacing a broken window or door
• Fixing a hole in the wall
• Replacing a light fixture

2. Major repairs that impact the house's structural integrity or change the use of space typically require a permit. Examples are:

• Replacing a foundation (or a part of the foundation)
• Replacing a roof.
• Adding or removing a wall (aside from a temporary wall that is not load-bearing.
• Converting a garage into living space.
• Adding a new deck or patio.

If you subcontract work out to licensed contractors, as an Owner-Builder, you still need to take responsibility that they are doing things according to code. Especially if you are sub-contracting work to unlicensed workers and the amount exceeds $500, you will need to get Workers' Compensation and keep records - as you will be considered an employer. It is always better to get Workers' Compensation to protect yourself from financial ruin if an employee is seriously injured on the job (which is easy enough to imagine in California).

Also to be mentioned: Hiring Mexican immigrants from in front of Home Depot is risky:

• They may not be legally authorized to work in the United States. This could put you at risk of fines and penalties from the government.
• They may not be skilled or experienced in the work you need to be done. This could lead to poor-quality work or even accidents.
• They may not be familiar with the safety regulations in your area. This could put them and you at risk of injury.
• Put it this way, - you may think you have hired them, but they have a hidden manager with attorneys you won't have a clue exist.
• Another facet: Other homeowners hire such workers and treat them unfairly (to say the least). By hiring such workers, you throw yourself into the same lot - unless you take precautions such as installing on-site video cameras and having temp workers sign some kind of contract (for what it is worth).

If you are considering hiring Mexican immigrants from in front of Home Depot, it is essential to do your research and take steps to protect yourself and your workers. Here are some tips:

• Ask for references and check them thoroughly.
• Make sure the workers have the necessary skills and experience for the job.
• Provide the workers with safety training and equipment.
• Pay the workers a fair wage and comply with all applicable labor laws.
• Make sure the workers have the necessary work permits.

Awareness of the potential for discrimination and exploitation is also essential. If you see something that concerns you, do not hesitate to report it to the authorities.

Here are some additional things to keep in mind:

• Hiring someone if you know they are not authorized to work in the United States is illegal.
• You can be held liable for any accidents or injuries to hired workers.
• It is essential to have a written contract with any workers you hire, outlining the scope of work, the pay rate, and any other essential terms and conditions.

 

[J Grant]

"Require a permit"

WHO requires a permit ??? Usually, not our client. And we work for our client. We do not work for the county or state or code enforcement (unless they are our client ).

Since the appraisal is usually done for valuation purposes, then if not having a permit impacts value, that is where it gets addressed. Appraise should make disclosures about what permits are found or known and can also say, "permit status unknown," if that is the case.

Make a disclaimer in the report that the appraisal is for evaluation purposes and that users or clients or readers are encouraged to do their own permit searches and due diligence regarding permits and any other kind of inspection or code compliances or construction issues.

If a client makes is that verifying a permit or making an owner obtain a permit as an assignment condition and the appraiser accepts it, then it becomes part of the assignment,

If the work done looks crappy, like it might affect health or safety, then call for an inspection or repair,

 

[Surf Cat]

If a client makes is that verifying a permit or making an owner obtain a permit as an assignment condition and the appraiser accepts it, then it becomes part of the assignment,

This. If it's a "requirement" you need to charge accordingly to go to the planning department, wait in line, and get the information needed. Otherwise, it's not within the scope of the assignment.

Make explicit notes, note that it's unknown of permits were acquired and it wasn't within the scope of the assignment to verify.

 

[Dublin ohio]

I have never been the permit police. First of all how do I know what requires a permit and what doesn't. In most of my areas. You can remodel your kitchen without a permit. As long as you do not move, add to or extend existing mechanicals. You can replace your sink and faucet without a permit. As long as it connects to the existing plumbing in the same spot. Now if something obvious catches my eye when a room addition or major interior structural modifications are made. I would probably question it. But otherwise I assume what I see is what you get. I used to be an electrician and can spot code violations that other appraiser's would have no knowledge of. But I am now an appraiser and I only call out the obvious.

 

[RCA]

This. If it's a "requirement" you need to charge accordingly to go to the planning department, wait in line, and get the information needed. Otherwise, it's not within the scope of the assignment.

Make explicit notes, note that it's unknown of permits were acquired and it wasn't within the scope of the assignment to verify.

For that Marin City case, I found the permit information online, without calling the Marin County planning department --- since I wasn't the appraiser and was just curious. I was surprised I could get such information so easily - the whole messy history of failed inspections .... and I am perplexed the original appraiser apparently didn't know anything about the issue.

- Now think about what if you had appraised a house and given it a good bill of health, in light of the fact that information to the contrary is freely available to the public.

- Think about the owner making statements on television that the appraiser had not given due credit to all the updates on the house at some hundreds of thousands of dollars for alleged work, without mentioning that he was acting as an Owner-Builder, when the permit fee was based on a much smaller expenditure and when he had failed a number of intermediate inspections and 3 years after the appraisal still hadn't passed the Final Inspection - yet won a lawsuit against the appraiser - who only has herself to blame for the whole mess?

I say it is best that you are fully aware of the landscape surrounding the appraisal. It is invariably more complicated than you probably think.

 

[Surf Cat]

For that Marin City case, I found the permit information online, without calling the Marin County planning department --- since I wasn't the appraiser and was just curious. I was surprised I could get such information so easily - the whole messy history of failed inspections .... and I am perplexed the original appraiser apparently didn't know anything about the issue.

- Now think about what if you had appraised a house and given it a good bill of health, in light of the fact that information to the contrary is freely available to the public.

- Think about the owner making statements on television that the appraiser had not given due credit to all the updates on the house at some hundreds of thousands of dollars for alleged work, without mentioning that he was acting as an Owner-Builder, when the permit fee was based on a much smaller expenditure and when he had failed a number of intermediate inspections and 3 years after the appraisal still hadn't passed the Final Inspection - yet won a lawsuit against the appraiser - who only has herself to blame for the whole mess?

I say it is best that you are fully aware of the landscape surrounding the appraisal. It is invariably more complicated than you probably think.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I'm fully aware of how complicated appraisals are. The more you think you know about appraising, the more you realize you don't know.

In the city of Los Angeles, permits for the subject and or comparables are readily available online. However, there are some incorporated cities within Los Angeles that you need to go to their planning department as they're not available online. These incorporated areas, is where I'm referring to in regards to acquiring permits. It's a lot of extra leg work to find out if these are or are not available in those situations. Therefore, I just disclose. Appraisers just don't get paid enough to verify all the particulars. Knowing which areas have permits available online comes with experience and being out there and doing it. Figuring out how to use those cities damn microfiche viewers...

I believe that the PAREA appraisers are just going to get left in the dust without a mentor to show them the ropes. They're going to be knee deep in it...(as we all have) and the lucky ones will find themselves here as they don't have a mentor. The others will turn the report in and hope for the best....

The Marin City appraiser got railroaded and everyone here knows it. She was the sacrificial lamb for "the cause", PAVE, votes. So unfortunate. Maybe Miller "did" have those permits and failed inspections in her appraisal..... we'll never know unless those appraisals are made available.

 

[RCA]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I'm fully aware of how complicated appraisals are. The more you think you know about appraising, the more you realize you don't know.

In the city of Los Angeles, permits for the subject and or comparables are readily available online. However, there are some incorporated cities within Los Angeles that you need to go to their planning department as they're not available online. These incorporated areas, is where I'm referring to in regards to acquiring permits. It's a lot of extra leg work to find out if these are or are not available in those situations. Therefore, I just disclose. Appraisers just don't get paid enough to verify all the particulars. Knowing which areas have permits available online comes with experience and being out there and doing it. Figuring out how to use those cities damn microfiche viewers...

I believe that the PAREA appraisers are just going to get left in the dust without a mentor to show them the ropes. They're going to be knee deep in it...(as we all have) and the lucky ones will find themselves here as they don't have a mentor. The others will turn the report in and hope for the best....

The Marin City appraiser got railroaded and everyone here knows it. She was the sacrificial lamb for "the cause", PAVE, votes. So unfortunate. Maybe Miller "did" have those permits and failed inspections in her appraisal..... we'll never know unless those appraisals are made available.

True, it's possible. Although, if that were the case, then the owner would surely not have a good one. But you could retort Judges can be thick-skinned - in a variety of ways.