Security bars- Conventional Loan

[apprzr951]

I did a conventional loan about two months ago everything was smooth until I get stip 2 weeks ago to “address the security bar on the window.” I pulled up the appraisal and sure enough there was a security bar on only one window of this entire house (quite honestly I did not even notice it until it was brought to my attention), that said I know security bars were not on any other windows based on all of my exterior photos. The UW wants to know if it had a safety release mechanism. I contacted the homeowner and added the following comments:

Per a detailed conversation with the homeowner the window identified is the ONLY window with the security bars on the entire house. This security bar was added by the previous owner and is equipped with a safety release mechanism per the current homeowner. It is further noted that the bedroom also has two additional windows WITHOUT safety bars which provides adequate egress in the event of a fire. Referring to the photo addendum (bedroom # 2) the reader will see an approximate 3X8 window behind the beds headboard on the east side of the bedroom and another 3X3 window (approximately) on the south side of the bedroom, both of these windows are easily accessible and can be utilized without concerns for egress in the event of a fire.

I get a stip today to go back and take a photo of the security bar and safety release mechanism. The fact that I originally overlooked this is on me, but I think this is ridiculous that lender wants me to go back out for this, especially when there are two other bigger windows in the same bedroom without security bars. Am I crazy or is this overkill. I know the fact that there is only one security bar is kind of weird; however the current owners purchased it this way. I have since contacted the homeowner to give her a heads up as to what is going on and she is pi**ed off (not at me) like you can’t believe. Well as it turns out the bar was not equipped with a safety release mechanism, the borrower said she is just going to remove the security bar to make this all go away. This isn’t even an FHA appraisal

How would you handle this?

 

[hastalavista]

Handle what?

1. The fact that the security bars weren't identified in the original report?
2. The fact that the borrower lied to you?
3. The fact that the lender wants you to go back out?


As to #1: Doesn't sound like a big deal to me. At least one other and possibly two other window-exits to the outside from the bedroom. Your comment about the existence of other exits should have ended the questioning... assuming (and I do assume this) that "checking all security bars on bedroom windows for release mechanisms" is not a assignment-engagement condition/requirement.

As to #2: Can't help you here! :new_smile-l:

As to #3: This would be a trip-charge in my book.


In the perfect world, the report would have noted the security bars without the release mechanism, stated that there were other exists from the bedroom, and that would be the end of it. Ok, so in the future, you'll probably do this. But for this assignment, with your photo documentation of the additional windows, there should not be an issue. If they want you to go back out, you should charge them a fee.

 

[Verne Hebert]

Where is this? Cutting and Carlson?

Build into the fee a bottle of Thunderbird for the trip back to the office.

 

[stefan olafson]

Go ahead and do what they ask and charge them mileage and a fee for the extra trip to the property.

Your explanation would suffice in most instances, just not for this lender.

I once did an appraisal in a small MN town on a sfd. The street scene had the town grain elevator in it, which is very typical for these two or three block wide towns built along the rail line.

The underwriter asked me to remove this picture and take a picture the other direction. I explained there was a farm shop two doors away, also quite typical but took the picture and charged them $75.00 for the extra work. A week later the UW called back saying they didn't like that picture either so could I take it on the next block, told them that was dishonest and refused. So the underwriter told me to angle the camera away from the shop area and send them a corrected photo page again. I went back,took another picture of the other grain elevator (which was in the shot) and sent it back in with another $75.00 charge.

Believe it or not they paid for both trips and only called twice more complaining, until I sent them a google earth picture of the town highlighting where the house was and the two grain elevators. That finally got the darn thing passed by the underwriter.

 

[Riick]

The concern about Security Bars is SOP - Standard Operating Procedure.

The OP needs to forget about FHA, every Lender is going to be concerned about security bars,
since their lawyers tell them that the Lender is potentially on the hook if there's a fire and someone is hurt.

The simple rule of thumb is to (a) look for them, (b) if you see them, take a photo, especially a
(c) photo of the quick-release mechanism, and finally (d) comment on their presence and whether
any or all had, or lacked, quick releases.

It's part of your responsibility to know this. Though HOW you'd learn it is beyond me.
((I never knew anything about this, for 15-20 years, then learned when I was a Reviewer at BigBank that did lots of Small Income properties.))

.

 

[normando]

Last year, I had a utility room in garage with security bars with no release mechanism. I stated that city ordinance doesn't require release mechanism for utility rooms.
The lender still had an issue with it and the frustrated borrower called me asking me what to do. I said fastest and quickest way to deal with the lender is to take it down so I can send the updated window photo to the lender.
It was done and problem resolved.

 

[VegasWayne]

Last year, I had a utility room in garage with security bars with no release mechanism. I stated that city ordinance doesn't require release mechanism for utility rooms.
The lender still had an issue with it and the frustrated borrower called me asking me what to do. I said fastest and quickest way to deal with the lender is to take it down so I can send the updated window photo to the lender.
It was done and problem resolved.

How much do you want to bet that the security bars went right back up after you took the picture.

 

[zdfenton]

How much do you want to bet that the security bars went right back up after you took the picture.

I once required securing of a patio door with a walkout basement below it and no deck, IE you could walk out the patio door and fall 6-8 feet. They put up a bunch of 2'x4's, I went out to take a picture, and the guy was standing there with thew screwgun waiting for me to leave so he could take it back down. He made a big show of it too

 

[Theresa2484]

Does anyone know of our responsibility on security bars? There are a lot of homes that have security bars on the windows where I appraise. If they don't have safety-release latches, do any of you condition for these to be removed? Is it a matter of a lender requirement or do you actually call the town to find out what's permitted? Around here, each City is different on fire codes - some require all bars to have release latches, while others do not.

 

[normando]

As I mentioned in my story, it doesn't matter what the city ordinance is although it's good to know. That doesn't mean all windows with security bars have to be removed. The lender has certain guidelines to be met. As long as there are no security bars on the questionable window, the lender has lessened it's liability. What the borrower does afterwards is their liability.
Also, have some of you encounter problems with photos of swimming pools without a fence near the rear of the house?