Summary Vs. Self Contained

[xm72mhd]

Originally posted by David Bodtcher@Aug 23 2005, 08:53 PM
And has anyone ever been asked to do one or the other? Are there things you would include about a property in the self contained that you wouldn't in a summary?

The requests don't come across that way. Its "give me another comp" or "explain zoning" or "what is that in the background of come photo 2". You are taking this to a matter fo style rather than a substantive was to do things.

What I hear the "old salts" say is to really consider the level of spohistication and needs of the client and their level of trust in you. Probably the less established your realtionship the more effort you put into detail and move to summarize from describe from describe in detail as time passes.

If you count your time in hours and earn money by selling it, then you may want to consider if you and your client can afford a full self contained report. Usually if a good summary suffices, why do a self contained.

Answer to second question. More detail, but nothing less of signifiance to the scope and reliability of the result.

 

[Jeff Horton]

Originally posted by Bob Ipock@Aug 23 2005, 04:13 PM
If an appraiser has taken and passed the 15 hour USPAP class and perhaps had even one update class....how could they possibly not know the difference between self-contained, summary and restricted use appraisal reports?

I am impressed if you remember everything you learned in your first classes. If I haven't used it or needed it then I have probably forgotten it. I guess I am bad appraiser?

 

[Austin]

Some of you guys have a test question mentality. “Recite what USPAP says is a self contained report?” There is no clear dividing line in the real world; it depends on the client’s needs and scope of appraisal. You can do two appraisals for the same client on the same property and both reports can be self-contained and one could be 20 pages and one 100 pages. I have never seen what I would classify as a self-contained report in the context some of you people seem to think it is. How many appraisals have you ever seen with a full level B or above market analysis? Isn’t a market analysis a USPAP requirement? If I submit one report with a level B market analysis and the other with a level D market analysis, does that make one self-contained and one summary? Like everything else in this business, it all depends. There is more to this business than passing a test. Appraisal is not about passing a test, it is about solving problems for the client. If the appraisal and report answer all of the clients questions and serve his or her purpose, it is a self-contained report. I read a report an MAI buddy of mine did on a 15-year old industrial building in a developing industrial park. He called it a self-contained report of full appraisal. He said the cost approach was not relevant. Should I turn him in? :blink:

 

[Fred]

David,
You are quite correct and the only one in thread to analyze and reference USPAP.

the word "describe" in the self contained exchanged for "summarize" in the summary.

Various ASB’s have tinkered around with the wording of 2-2 xince the report options were put into USPAP mid-year 1994. However, the options have never made sense. Most views you will encounter involve a lot of ***-uming.

There is no benefit in mincing words. USPAP is just a badly put together document that shows no sign of improving and this is another example of it.

Getting to the spirit and letter of you question, describe and summarize sound like grammar standards; and USPAP has NEVER identified a single item of substance that must be included in a description, but that could be excluded in a summary.

 

[David Bodtcher]

Thanks everyone. So it is more under the appraiser's own discretion as to whether it is a self contained or summary & the only way for someone to distingush which one the appraisal is, is by what the appraiser calls it?

 

[Otis Key]

Originally posted by David Bodtcher@Aug 23 2005, 11:40 PM
Thanks everyone. So it is more under the appraiser's own discretion as to whether it is a self contained or summary & the only way for someone to distingush which one the appraisal is, is by what the appraiser calls it?

Sorry I got here late..........Uh, never mind. I agree with Bob.














Naw - I won't even go there.

 

[Blue1]

I can't figure out what the difference is between a summary appraisal & a self contained. & why would you use one instead of the other?

There is no such thing as a summary appraisal. There is, however, a summary REPORT. and a self contained REPORT. These are reporting options.

An APPRAISAL may be LIMITED, COMPLETE or RESTRICTED. When one leaves out an approach to value it MAY be called a LIMITED appraisal which may be on a 2055 form which is a SUMMARY report.

That's the way I learned it anyway....

 

[xm39hnu]

David,
It's a matter of what your peers do, according to USPAP. This is because USPAP doesn't tell you how to describe anything. Nor does it tell you how to summarize information, or how much information constitutes a summary. The URAR, for example, has certain elements of a restricted use report: In the neighborhood section, you "state" with a check mark that the market is declining, stable, or increasing (that whole check box section is a bunch of "statements.") The highest and best use block "states" the HBU, and according to the form, you only have to "explain" if you check "Other." USPAP, though, wants you to "summarize" your reasoning for your HBU determination in such a way that the user can follow it from beginning to conclusion.

For Self Contained, (if I ever had the cojones to so label a report) I would include detailed support for every statement made. How do you know the market is stable? Where'd you get the data? Show it to me. How do these data indicate a stable market? (Oh, and is this level of analysis congruent with the scope of work? Do you need a more detailed examination of the market?)

Can you imagine the volume of information you'd have to provide to support local building costs? Breakdown method depreciation? Market extraction of *each* adjustment made in the market grid? Data to support your choice of a yield cap rate? Explaining (and providing data for) why you used yield cap instead of overall cap?

So a Self-Contained Report starts at a minimum of $3,000; some won't do one for less than $5,000. And that's on a non-complex property. Someone said the difference was 50 - 100 pages. That's a little conservative, IMO.

Now, you could write a self-contained report and label it a summary without being in violation of USPAP. You could also label it restricted use, and not be in violation. But if you label it Self-Contained and happen to summarize one little thing, you're in violation.

Safest thing to do is a good, detailed scope of work: What the client wants, what he's going to do with it, and how you'll go about providing it. After you've met the requirements of the SOW, look at the report and *then* label it appropriate to the level of reporting you actually used. Personally, I'll be glad to see SOW take over next year--for the reasons illustrated above.

 

[David Bodtcher]

Wow, thanks Jim!

 

[Carnivore]

Jim,

Just how would a reader know if your self contained report was actually self contained? I suppose one way would be to read the SOW. What if there are conflicting sources that may result in different conclusions?

I think the reporting options were meant to stand alone because there were never any standard parameters except the minimums requirements. The terms are meaningless to everyone except to other appraisers. For example, establishing minimums(USPAP SR2-2a) for a self contained report comes across as oxymoronic. That implies that there must be a maximum for a summary(Who determines that?).

The only one that made any sense was the restricted use(USPAP 2-2c). Clearly, this is a good one because it placed all unintended readers(unintended users) on notice that they may not be able to understand how you got to the report conclusions. A review report is a good example of a restricted report.