VA input request re: missing porch railing

[Hank Outlaw]

Hello,

I recently appraised a split foyer home with a front porch that was approx. 6' off the ground. There was no handrail. The owners have concrete planters around the perimeter of the porch, which are not permanent and are only approx. 12-18" high (photo attached).

I prepared the appraisal report subject to several repairs, including installing / constructing handrails where missing (safety issue). I cannot find any verbiage in the VA Handbook with regard to dimensions of the handrail (i.e., height, spacing of pickets, etc.), and the listing agent has asked for specifics. I suggested having the handrail built to local applicable building code.

I would appreciate any comments, advice, admonishments, etc. on this subject, particularly if anyone can cite "chapter & verse" as to porch rail dimensions, e.g., height, picket spacing, etc.

Thanks in advance.

Hank O.

 

[AnonApprsr]

I doubt there will be any specific requirement with height/width details. It's simply a safety issue.

 

[Hank Outlaw]

Just an FYI. in case you run across this issue.

There apparently are no specific guidelines or rules with regard to the construction of porch handrails where missing with regard to height, picket spacing, etc.

I suppose that it would be prudent to refer to local [applicable] building code(s), at least with regard to porch handrail height and structure (i.e., 2x4 vs. 1x2 lumber or decorative trellis screening). Sounds like a judgment call on the part of the appraiser... I just like to refer to "chapter and verse" if possible.

Hank O.

 

[Don Clark]

Roanoke RLC/Appraisers Guide

This is all it states:

Handrails. Handrails having a minimum and maximum heights of 30 inches and 38 inches (762 mm and 965 mm) respectively measured vertically from the nosing of the treads, shall be provided on at least one side of stairways of three or more risers​

Guardrails. Porches, balconies and raised floor surfaces located more that 30 inches (762 mm) above the floor or grade below shall have guardrails not less than 36 inches (914 mm) in height. Open sides of stairs with a total rise of more than 30 inches (762 mm) above the floor or grade below shall have guardrails not less than 34 inches (864 mm) in height measured vertically from the nosing of the treads.

 

[residentialguy]

There are a ton of codes with decks and railings. Type of fasteners, spacing of the slates not being over 4 3/8", Height of railing, etc.

I don't recommend that you state one code. Is that permission to break the others? You're not a building code inspector.

Keep it generic: Due to safety concerns, deck handrails must be installed in compliance to local building codes requirements.

 

[incognito]

Keep it generic: Due to safety concerns, deck handrails must be installed in compliance to local building codes requirements.

That makes us the code police. When the appraiser goes out to do the repair inspection, how will he/she certify it meets code, unless they go with a code enforcement officer or building official? If you require it to be built to code, you have to know, explicitly, what code is. I suppose you could demand the repair be completed by permit (which would imply an inspection by a building official),but many areas do not require permits for such improvements...

I would recommend using Dons verbiage, which is also applicable in the SE region for the VA in St. Pete.

 

[residentialguy]

That makes us the code police. I would recommend using Dons verbiage

I disagree. When doing the final, you state that the railing is in place, add a photo of the railing (and city inspection sign off, if applicable). Then state your typical CYA that any verification of code complaince is beyond your expertise, you're making an extraodinary assumption that is was done to code and if concerned, the lender should seek the services of a professional in that area.

If you just say the railing has to be 30 inches and a kid falls through it, the first thing the homeowner is going to say is "the appraiser said it only needed to be 30 inches high"

No thanks

 

[Don Clark]

I disagree. When doing the final, you state that the railing is in place, add a photo of the railing (and city inspection sign off, if applicable). Then state your typical CYA that any verification of code complaince is beyond your expertise, you're making an extraodinary assumption that is was done to code and if concerned, the lender should seek the services of a professional in that area.

If you just say the railing has to be 30 inches and a kid falls through it, the first thing the homeowner is going to say is "the appraiser said it only needed to be 30 inches high"

No thanks

I disagree with your statement. I state that it is a VA MPR issue, not a Don clark issue. I do the final inspection to see that it meets VA requirements, not any code requirement. Most of the time there would likely not be a code violation to begin with, but there would be a VA MPR violation.

 

[residentialguy]

I don't do VA. But, isn't any safety issue a VA MPR issue?

 

[residentialguy]

This is all it states:

Handrails. Handrails having a minimum and maximum heights of 30 inches and 38 inches (762 mm and 965 mm) respectively measured vertically from the nosing of the treads, shall be provided on at least one side of stairways of three or more risers ​

Guardrails. Porches, balconies and raised floor surfaces located more that 30 inches (762 mm) above the floor or grade below shall have guardrails not less than 36 inches (914 mm) in height. Open sides of stairs with a total rise of more than 30 inches (762 mm) above the floor or grade below shall have guardrails not less than 34 inches (864 mm) in height measured vertically from the nosing of the treads.

These railings fit your only qualifier(height)...do they meet VA MPR?