Comp Cruncher

[JSmith43]

A Summary Appraisal Report, not restricted use, BTW.

 

[Hamlet]

Amazing. This is why you are vendors and not in control of your industry. You are a labor pool being harvested. Not that CC is the answer, but new technology that you could leverage comes along and what to you do? Hitch up your Amish team and gotomeeting to decry the advancement. Meanwhile, the work is going to non-appraisers that you could be doing but you wont even try, cuz it's not what you are used to, then want the government to save you? Ever heard of free market dynamics? Its hopeless thinking appraisers are going to be able to solve this. You cant even go so far as to find out if something is worthwhile before trashing it. Most have invested NO time learning anything about the new developments,.. but know this: your competition is smart, alive and well and doing all they can to take as much of the market they can while you shake your heads. I suspect imurry is a bradford guy with bradford underwear, but there are other emerging systems out there, and you probably wont look into those either................... or before you allow your face to be completely stolen off your heads, will you entertain some new things to combat the erosion of your market share? What are you offering to clients besides "just say no, to avm and BPO " cuz, well, I'm an Appraiser, and that should count on it's own, right? hello? hello?? No one cares about that?? hmmm What does the market need? and "should" don't cut it

As has been pointed out...the problem is the liability for the appraiser. As far as free market...that has been taken away from the appraiser a long time ago....it is called the HVCC.:new_smile-l:

 

[Roy Courtney]

Wouldn't it be great if the appraiser lost his/her license/certification for preparing one of these?:icon_mrgreen:

 

[JSmith43]

Wouldn't it be great if the appraiser lost his/her license/certification for preparing one of these?:icon_mrgreen:

I think an appraisal board would wait for a rather extreme case. Bradford might be wise to throw in a legal defense fund, maybe throw half the $500 into a defense slush fund that could be used to defend appraisers using this sort of product.

But, if they are touting this exterior only report for divorce or tax work, the fund might deplete quite rapidly. I don't think there will be many complaints raised by so called sophisticated users, for they live in glass houses & know what they are getting for the most part.

 

[Doug Smith SRA]

Question

My grandmother when confronted with anything new, typically exclaimed:

"What's the good of it?"

I have a simple question. PC Murcor trolls with $200.00 1004 offers. CA appraisers in high density markets report this floor is broken and there are appraisers doing $175.00 full appraisals.

One firm here in Missoula Montana cranks out BPO's at a $45.00 average fee.

Why would anyone buy a $165.00 Comp Cruncher when you can get the real thing for $175.00 or by this summer when baby needs new shoes for $150.00? If you are in bail bond business, having a divorce, need some figures for a portfolio re-examination why would you pay $165.00 for a Comp Cruncher when you can get an astute opinion of value from a trusted broker in your own town for $45.00?

I have to see the market. I am not seeing the market. In Missoula, Montana, the VA pays $500.00. The standard rate for an appraisal is $450.00 to $600.00. Yet I thought I would play the troll game and respond to every request for a $200.00 appraisal with a counter offer. Say what? When we went to respond with a counter offer, the order was already placed. Someone is taking these orders "because it was slow."

I would like to make one other point. As of January 1, 2008, the AQB put every appraiser on notice that to protect the public trust the AQB was going to include a college course in statistics in the set of courses necessary for college equivalency failing having a college degree or degree from a junior college. The implication is that every appraiser should have in their background a full credit college course in statistics to protect the public trust.

I think I can safely say, most don't!

Therefore... Anyone relying on taking the CC course who does not have a full college credit course in statistics is in violation of USPAP. Read AO-18 and the list of required college credit courses for college equivalency published by by the AQB.

One last note on sample size. If residential appraisers are going to argue sample size, look out when you are on the stand when asked about the sample size for a typical 1004. Is your sample size statistically significant?

I have long predicted the advent of the CC and others in articles entitled "Is There a Blue Box in your Future?" in a take off on the language in AO-18 that talks about Orange Boxes, Green Boxes and Blue Boxes. These may come and they may play a role in appraising but if you read AO-18, the word "competency" is mentioned over and over again for some very good reasons. Anyone jumping on the CC bandwagon should face up the real requirement and start by reading and understanding AO-18.

So "What's the Good of it?"

Doug

 

[JSmith43]

Doug, I assume your greater point is that CompCruncher is going to over-sell the statistics and unsophisticated users will be unduly impressed and influenced with the charts and graphs generated in the report.

I skimmed over the SOW/conditions in the report & I would sure as heck want to customize it a bit. I wonder if the "franchise rules" don't permit this or if the reporting software does not provide room for such clarifications.

Take the training to find out, I guess.

 

[lmurry]

Hey gents,
I spent an hour answering all your comments and the when I went to post I had to refresh and log in again. I will try again later.

 

[lmurry]

To all concerned

Gents I have read you comments with great interest. I thought I would answer some.
Mentor:
It is hard to get the message out about CVR. I am glad I am not a overly handsome fellow and use to rejection, for I would be very depressed right now. On the other hand, there are a few institutions using the CVR in their business models. There is a bank in Florida that allows the appraiser to determine if the CVR is appropriate of another form. The appraiser charges accordingly. There is also a credit union in NoCal using the CVR; and, U S Bank announced in June that they will began to incorporate CVR into their business model. unfortunately they are going through an AMC and frankly the pay structure is disappointing.
The CVR is any kind of appraisal report the appraiser chooses depending on the scope of work. The CVR can be a 1004 and a 1004MC on steroids, it can be a 2055 and 1073. it is very flexible. There is a three page report we call a Executive report that give you list price, sale price and the ratio between the two, Absorption rate, whether list prices are going up or down in the subject area, a defined boundary area plus graph and chart to support the written information.
By the way, on the very first page paragraph five it says, "The appraisal was developed and the report was prepared in accordance with the Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice." Make no mistake, this can be a summary appraisal report.
There is no need for a defense fund. I would invite you to open up a little and understand you are comparing this report to a 28 to 30 year old system and it is a thousand time better in that it is transparent and as i said before just the first three pages give you more information than the URAR.
NSTANBRU:
If you and Mentor were sitting across from each other and you told Mentor his home was worth an exact value, you have just given Mentor an appraisal report and you are liable for that figure and Mentor could take you to court; why, because you are an appraiser. So why can the CVR be an appraisal report.
Hamlet:
One of the problem we are having right now is we don't really understand what HVCC is. In a nutshell, it is a de facto administration guideline corrupted by the banking system to make people think they are compelled to use an AMC. Nothing can be further from the truth. If you really study the HVCC you will find that it compels that the loan production staff can not have contact with the appraiser and there must be at least one reporting level between the person ordering the appraisal and the loan production staff. The loan production staff would be the ones whose earning is based on commission from the loan. HVCC does not compel anybody to use an AMC. What the banks have done however is to only accept report through their AMC giving the illusion that is the law making it impossible for a small bank or mortgage broker to comply with HVCC unless it is done the way the banks want it done.
Courtney:
I am in no more danger of losing my license than you are. Maybe even less so. I plow the same amount of acreage that you do, except my software renders a better yield of information so that I have to do less explaining.
Finally...
DOUG SMITH, SRA
I had done only a few of these reports. I get the $200 I ask for because the individuals and the other institutions I mentioned earlier except U S Bank are ordering directly from the appraiser and by-passing the AMC. Remember, the client is paying the AMC $400 to $500+ for the appraisal report. You are only referring to what the AMC is paying us. As far as the BPO, is a client wants to get an opinion of value from somebody untrained for that work there is nothing I can do about that.
I fully admit that i am seeking work that do not involve and GSE. I look for private money lenders, heloc and non-lending work. If a GSE is not involved, by default that eliminates the AMC. I want to move away from the GSEs as much as possible because the banks are too powerful and the GSE's are corrupt and need to be reformed. (that is my political statement of the day.) At the same time, I would not hesitate to submit a CVR for loan origination again because it is more detailed and transparent over the the standard GSE approved forms. I believe the CVR would stand up in court without a problem. and it is so informative, it could render the expert witness obsolete.
The really KWEL thing about CVR is you don't have to know statistics. All you need do is draw your boundaries, pull your comps from your local MLS and the software does the number crunching
Finally a question: How many comps do you pull in your sample comparison?
Well Gents that is it. Forgive me for not going back and checking for errors.
I respect you all.

 

[Randolph Kinney]

The really KWEL thing about CVR is you don't have to know statistics.

I believe the CVR would stand up in court without a problem.

How credible of a witness are you on the stand in a trial?

Attorney: This is your appraisal report, you call it CVR?

lmurry: Yes, that is ocrrect.

Attorney: So tell me lmurry, what does this statistic mean and how does that relate to your opinion of value? How many samples are necessary to produce a reliable statistic?

 

[Roy Courtney]

I admit that I have not taken the time to check this out. Maybe it is just what we all need. Will this give us a way to work even cheaper? We sure need to be able to charge less and less.

I received an assignment today on a refinance. It is a waterfront home on a private lake. A quick check of the M.L.S. indicates a total of TWO (2) total sales in this area within the past THREE YEARS! Comp cruncher??? My AZZ!:new_all_coholic: