Will You Get The Vaccine?

[Sadie]

Okay.

Please discuss in the appropriate detail each bullet point so that we can understand what this has to do with the original post.

I think NachoPerito was referring to the science being wearing masks. The bullet points are cites not separate statements.

 

[Dublin ohio]

You sound so sure of yourself. These scientists are also sure of themselves

Recent studies​

• Mueller AV, Eden MJ, Oakes JM, et al. Quantitative Method for Comparative Assessment of Particle Removal Efficiency of Fabric Masks as Alternatives to Standard Surgical Masks for PPE (July 2020). https://doi.org/10.1016/j.matt.2020.07.006external icon https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2590238520303647external icon
• Anindita M, Das K.COVID-19 Pandemic: Is Cloth Mask Really Protect Public From SARS-CoV-2? (The way of handling to get Results) (May 2020). https://www.ijisrt.com/assets/upload/files/IJISRT20MAY228.pdfpdf iconexternal icon
• Lustig SR, Biswakarma JJH, Rana D, et al. Effectiveness of Common Fabrics to Block Aqueous Aerosols of Virus-like Nanoparticles (May 2020). https://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/acsnano.0c03972external icon
• Sousa‐Pinto B, Fonte AP, Lopes AA, et al.Face masks for community use: An awareness call to the differences in materials (August 2020). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7361409/external icon
• Chughtai AA, Seale H, Macintyre CR. Effectiveness of Cloth Masks for Protection Against Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2 (July 2020). https://europepmc.org/article/med/32639930external icon
• Bagheri MH, Khalaj I, Azizi A, et al. Filtration Efficiency, Breathability, and Reusability of Improvised Materials for Face Masks (July 2020) PREPRINT. https://engrxiv.org/nrtgb/external icon
• Gandhi M, Beyrer C, Goosby E. Masks Do More Than Protect Others During COVID-19:
• Reducing the Inoculum of SARS-CoV-2 to Protect the Wearer. J Gen Intern Med. DOI: 10.1007/s11606-020-06067-8
• Wang H, Wang Q, Lin YL, Kilinc-Balci FS, Price A, Chu L, Chu MC. Household materials selection for homemade cloth face coverings and their filtration efficiency enhancement with triboelectric charging. Nano Letters. 2020 Jun 2.”
• Rothe C, Schunk M, Sothmann P, et al. Transmission of 2019-nCoV Infection from an Asymptomatic Contact in Germany. The New England journal of medicine. 2020;382(10):970-971.
• Zou L, Ruan F, Huang M, et al. SARS-CoV-2 Viral Load in Upper Respiratory Specimens of Infected Patients. The New England journal of medicine. 2020;382(12):1177-1179.
• Pan X, Chen D, Xia Y, et al. Asymptomatic cases in a family cluster with SARS-CoV-2 infection. The Lancet Infectious diseases. 2020.
• Bai Y, Yao L, Wei T, et al. Presumed Asymptomatic Carrier Transmission of COVID-19. Jama. 2020.
• Kimball A HK, Arons M, et al. Asymptomatic and Presymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 Infections in Residents of a Long-Term Care Skilled Nursing Facility — King County, Washington, March 2020. MMWR Morbidity and mortality weekly report. 2020; ePub: 27 March 2020.
• Wei WE LZ, Chiew CJ, Yong SE, Toh MP, Lee VJ. Presymptomatic Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 — Singapore, January 23–March 16, 2020. MMWR Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report. 2020;ePub: 1 April 2020.
• Li R, Pei S, Chen B, et al. Substantial undocumented infection facilitates the rapid dissemination of novel coronavirus (SARS-CoV2). Science (New York, NY). 2020.
• Furukawa NW, Brooks JT, Sobel J. Evidence Supporting Transmission of Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2 While Presymptomatic or Asymptomatic [published online ahead of print, 2020 May 4]. Emerg Infect Dis. 2020;26(7):10.3201/eid2607.201595. Link
• Oran DP, Topol Prevalence of Asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 Infection: A Narrative Review [published online ahead of print, 2020 Jun 3]. Ann Intern Med. 2020;M20-3012.
• National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. 2020. Rapid Expert Consultation on the Possibility of Bioaerosol Spread of SARS-CoV-2 for the COVID-19 Pandemic (April 1, 2020). Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. https://doi.org/10.17226/25769external icon
• Schwartz KL, Murti M, Finkelstein M, et al. Lack of COVID-19 transmission on an international flight. CMAJ. 2020;192(15):E410.
• Anfinrud P, Stadnytskyi V, Bax CE, Bax A. Visualizing Speech-Generated Oral Fluid Droplets with Laser Light Scattering. N Engl J Med. 2020 Apr 15. doi:10.1056/NEJMc2007800.
• Davies A, Thompson KA, Giri K, Kafatos G, Walker J, Bennett A. Testing the efficacy of homemade masks: would they protect in an influenza pandemic? Disaster Med Public Health Prep. 2013;7(4):413-8.
• Konda A, Prakash A, Moss GA, Schmoldt M, Grant GD, Guha S. Aerosol Filtration Efficiency of Common Fabrics Used in Respiratory Cloth Masks. ACS Nano. 2020 Apr 24.
• Aydin O, Emon B, Saif MTA. Performance of fabrics for home-made masks against spread of respiratory infection through droplets: a quantitative mechanistic study. medRxiv preprint doi: https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.04.19.20071779, posted April 24, 2020.
• Ma QX, Shan H, Zhang HL, Li GM, Yang RM, Chen JM. Potential utilities of mask-wearing and instant hand hygiene for fighting SARS-CoV-2. J Med Virol. 2020.
• Leung, N.H.L., Chu, D.K.W., Shiu, E.Y.C. et al.Respiratory virus shedding in exhaled breath and efficacy of face masks. Nat Med. 2020.
• Johnson DF, Druce JD, Birch C, Grayson ML. A quantitative assessment of the efficacy of surgical and N95 masks to filter influenza virus in patients with acute influenza infection. Clin Infect Dis. 2009 Jul 15;49(2):275-7.
• Green CF, Davidson CS, Panlilio AL, et al. Effectiveness of selected surgical masks in arresting vegetative cells and endospores when worn by simulated contagious patients. Infect Control Hosp Epidemiol. 2012;33(5):487‐494.

For every scientist or study that says "x". You can find an equally reputable scientist or study that says "y". Not agreeing or disagreeing. Just sayin'.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

In the chart above I see that Spain, Italy, Germany, UK and US are listed as "no masks"...Com'n. How about the truth instead? All of them require masks. And how about the death rate?

The 1918 flu ran its course in 2 years without a vaccine. Most masks then were gauze. The studies I've read (abstracts there of mostly) suggest masks are partially effective in a clinical situation- which is where virtually all these studies occur. - hospital staff, patients, etc. But the studies that attempt to gauge the effectiveness of masks out there, in the "community use" sector are far less convinced they help much. No, not a big issue to wear a mask but I've not run into anyone how has caught it that is not wearing a mask in stores and at work. And I see stupid stuff mandated by companies. Truck drivers. I don't know how many solo truck drivers I've met wearing a mask in their truck. That's just plain stupid, but they do it to keep their jobs. And I know a truck driver who got Covid apparently while traveling from here to Wyoming and back...never ate in a restaurant and always stopped at a fast food place or truck stop and ate in his truck.

 

[The Warrior Monk]

You are insulting someone else for thieir lack of comprehension and you are the MODERATOR

Thank you for you input.

 

[Sadie]

For every scientist or study that says "x". You can find an equally reputable scientist or study that says "y". Not agreeing or disagreeing. Just sayin'.

I don't think the arguments against the face masks are scientists. or at least scientist who study infectious diseases.
Even in 1918, there was a consensus on wearing masks. Face masks are not a new thing.
Article for you The Forgotten Science Behind Face Masks (webmd.com)

 

[The Warrior Monk]

I think NachoPerito was referring to the science being wearing masks. The bullet points are cites not separate statements.

Citing piles of references without having read them isn't support, hence my comments. As someone who personally spent a whole lot of time going through references and footnotes (physics grad), it's obviously that all of the references won't necessarily support the article. Particular references may be cited, but contradictory data may be included in the referenced study that is not included in the current article.

I've been reading studies on face masks for months. And that's why I don't wear them. The efficacy of the masks is such that there is a good chance that one will catch the virus wearing a face mask for months on end of being exposed to a viral environment.

I only wear respirators (N95+) on appointments.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

Gandhi M, Beyrer C, Goosby E. Masks Do More Than Protect Others During COVID-19:

A most curious paper I might add...

Asymptomatic infections may be harmful for spread but could actually be beneficial if they lead to higher rates of exposure.​

​

Our theory is based on the likelihood of masking reducing the viral inoculum to which the mask-wearer is exposed, leading to higher rates of mild or asymptomatic infection with COVID-19.​

​

These studies have limitations, since experiments to examine the dose of virus to achieve its LD50 have necessarily not been conducted in humans.​

​

It assumes much as part of their "theory" about masks reducing but not stopping covid infection and that this lessened exposure therefore would mean you get a smaller "viral load" and thereby develop an immune response without getting the disease, but of course, we don't know because we didn't test it on humans. And this **** is what we call "science" today and not even peer reviewed as best I can tell.

​

 

[Sadie]

Citing piles of references without haven't read them isn't support, hence my comments.

I've been reading studies on face masks for months. And that's why I don't wear them. The efficacy of the masks is such that there is a good chance that one will catch the virus wearing a face mask for months on end of being exposed to a viral environment.

I only wear respirators (N95+) on appointments.

Maybe you should read a little more on this. There is actually quite a bit of lab and anecdotal evidence behind the mask wearing. Why do you wear a N95 on appointments if you don't think masks work? If you are referring to the cloth masks, evidence suggests the virus doesn't live long on masks. Also what if you are a asymptomatic super spreader? Wearing a mask will probably keep you from infecting multiple people. And they keep your face warm this time of year.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

anecdotal evidence

non-reproducible single occurrences are of no significance to science - Karl Popper

what if you are a asymptomatic super spreader?

 

[Sadie]

A most curious paper I might add...

Asymptomatic infections may be harmful for spread but could actually be beneficial if they lead to higher rates of exposure.​

​

Our theory is based on the likelihood of masking reducing the viral inoculum to which the mask-wearer is exposed, leading to higher rates of mild or asymptomatic infection with COVID-19.​

​

These studies have limitations, since experiments to examine the dose of virus to achieve its LD50 have necessarily not been conducted in humans.​

​

It assumes much as part of their "theory" about masks reducing but not stopping covid infection and that this lessened exposure therefore would mean you get a smaller "viral load" and thereby develop an immune response without getting the disease, but of course, we don't know because we didn't test it on humans. And this **** is what we call "science" today and not even peer reviewed as best I can tell.

​

The problem here is there is no guarantee who you infect will be asymptomatic. And if whoever they infect won't get super sick. This virus is so new and unpredictable. Some report are stating the new mutation is afflicting more younger people. I think we can all agree that none of us want this and we all want it to be in the rear view mirror.