All Solar, Et Al, In 12 Years?

[ucbruin]

Looks like they already do considering how much we owe them...but controlling us...That is a different issue from "owning" us.

Japan influenced a lot of things in the 1980s. For one, it frightened car companies into realizing that the Vega's, Mavericks and Gremlins of the world were crap cars and the consumer wanted a better car. Remember, if you got 100,000 miles out of a car, it was exceptional. Today, 300,000 miles is the old 100,000. That is all a result of the American car companies building cars that frequently beat the Japanese quality..(I know, I know, diehard Toy or other maker fans don't believe it, but the numbers are probably pretty fair measure of "quality")

Japan is the model our FED has used in dealing with the crunch of 09... and the sobering truth is the playbook says we are going to be "down" for about 2 decades or more. China? Who knows. They are growing "too fast" but they also will be the # 1 economic power in the world eventually.

Wasn't that the same thing said about Japan in the 70s/80s? Weren't they buying our debt? Were Americans afraid Japan would become the world's #1 economy?

 

[ucbruin]

2. Americans gnashing teeth when Japanese investors purchased Rockefeller Center? Eventually it was a money losing investment.

Try again.

It lost money because of the S&L crisis. Do you see a repeat of history here? No yield in foreign countries, their rich come here and buy real estate. We loosen lending (wink, wink, nudge, nudge) Oh no, an economic crisis and the value of real estate drops substantially. Sorry, you lose your investment.

This is the industry of central banking. They don't make things to sell. They don't provide anything of human value. They just keep moving the cheese until they put it the trap that slams shut on you, and they keep your cheese.

Why is it that people think this is not the way it is?

Does it really matter the reason Japan's investments in the "jewels" of America's real estate lost them money?

 

[ucbruin]

Just remember, running a trade deficit means you are exporting jobs besides the money that would have gone to workers here.

Cost of labor in America was higher than Japan, Japan catches up. Cost of labor in Japan higher than Taiwan, Taiwan catches up. Cost of labor in Taiwan is higher than Indonesia, Indonesia catches up. Cost of labor in Indonesia is higher than Mexico, Mexico catches up. Cost labor in Mexico higher than China, China catches up.......

Consumers want to pay the lowest price possible for merchandise. Are we willing to pay higher prices to support higher paying manufacturing jobs here in America? No one wants to pay an extra $0.50 for that fast food burger. Could you imagine the outcry for major items?

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

Wasn't that the same thing said about Japan in the 70s/80s? Weren't they buying our debt? Were Americans afraid Japan would become the world's #1 economy

Not really. We did recognize that the U. S. in the 1970s lost out of productivity, quality, and craftsmanship and we became a trade deficit nation.... We still are. Name the countries that have a trade surplus. Japan has an energy problem in the 1980s, and have a serious one now due to Fukushima. But Japanese citizens were middle and lower middle class even in the 1980s. China has a billion people living in nigh poverty and thus can draw upon their own human capital for decades to come. And you only have to give all those peasants a mo-ped and you will create another energy crisis over night.

Are we willing to pay higher prices to support higher paying manufacturing jobs here in America? No one wants to pay an extra $0.50 for that fast food burger

The consumer says "no". Nations compete like states are competing for plants. They dangle money and perks on people to draw them to build in their country and decry their callus behavior when they make entirely economic decisions. We are a bipolar world. We expect the corporation to be subservient to the interests of the state but OTOH governments will pillar them for not maximizing the profits of the shareholders.

 

[Meandering]

Does it really matter the reason Japan's investments in the "jewels" of America's real estate lost them money?

Yes it does matter,

Because that's how you find the patterns.

 

[ucbruin]

What's the pattern?

Other than countries with the cheapest labor force gets a turn to cycle out of having the cheapest labor force.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

What's the pattern?

Other than countries with the cheapest labor force gets a turn to cycle out of having the cheapest labor force.

Look to Africa as the next great play like Asia as cheaper labor draws from the population there. Eventually, even the Middle East can be drawn in provided that oil plays out or no longer pays all the bills and then look for them to provide cheap labor... by that time perhaps we will be an impoverished nation and our dollar weakens to where we can reclaim our old status by being the place for the world to go to find "cheap" labor.

 

[Randolph Kinney]

Cost of labor in America was higher than Japan, Japan catches up. Cost of labor in Japan higher than Taiwan, Taiwan catches up. Cost of labor in Taiwan is higher than Indonesia, Indonesia catches up. Cost of labor in Indonesia is higher than Mexico, Mexico catches up. Cost labor in Mexico higher than China, China catches up.......

Consumers want to pay the lowest price possible for merchandise. Are we willing to pay higher prices to support higher paying manufacturing jobs here in America? No one wants to pay an extra $0.50 for that fast food burger. Could you imagine the outcry for major items?

Labor is a competitive edge coupled with foreign exchange rates of the currency, however, you can't make semiconductors or autos without the transfer of technology to do it and the infrastructure to support it. We exported our technology, we built factories in free trade zones. The quality comes from automation. Cost reduction came from tax advantages as well as high volume.

The more important parameter was taxes since labor and capital are taxed more here than there.

 

[ucbruin]

Look to Africa as the next great play like Asia as cheaper labor draws from the population there. Eventually, even the Middle East can be drawn in provided that oil plays out or no longer pays all the bills and then look for them to provide cheap labor... by that time perhaps we will be an impoverished nation and our dollar weakens to where we can reclaim our old status by being the place for the world to go to find "cheap" labor.

I have noticed news reports saying that China is looking to invest heavily in Africa. Cheapest labor force...the cycle continues.

Most, if not all, of us contributing to this thread will be long gone before America becomes an impoverished nation. And for those who aren't long gone, it still won't matter.

 

[ucbruin]

Labor is a competitive edge coupled with foreign exchange rates of the currency, however, you can't make semiconductors or autos without the transfer of technology to do it and the infrastructure to support it. We exported our technology, we built factories in free trade zones. The quality comes from automation. Cost reduction came from tax advantages as well as high volume.

The more important parameter was taxes since labor and capital are taxed more here than there.

Taxes, isn't that sort of like saying CEO pay doesn't really impact employee pay?