AMC's, Please reduce my fees further

[Roy Courtney]

I suppose I should have said I was joking in my previous post in case anyone was offended. I love the appraisal profession and wish the best for all of you in the same boat with me! I hope we can work together and make this a profession to be proud of!

 

[Chelley Bahner]

So by that thinking, is it o.k. if we underpay & take advantage of immigrant workers, just because there are more of them then we need. What about suddenly paying all construction workers 1/2 pay or less, because we have half the demand for homes now? Should farmers not get subsidies, and go out of business, on years when supply & demand are imbalanced? What about jobs in general, relating to younger workers. Do you feel comftorable having your job replaced by a younger worker at half pay, just because they were available. Established workers should maintain respect, and the oversupply, simply does not work, and supply finds balance again. FORCED blanket fee reductions across the board is not sensible. By your own words it's "Taking Advantage".

That's dangerous thinking Chelly, in my opinion of course. The act of taking advatage of another, should always be a matter of concern. IF there are too many, then of course, some balances must be met. But blanket sweeps of 70% pay reductions? Are you familliar with the way unions work, It sounds like you don't support union mentallity. This quote is not exactly relevant, but it came to mind, and I love to post quotes! I think it deals with similar estrangement & misunderstanding issues.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me - and there was no one left to speak for me.
:new_2gunsfiring_v1:

The only dangerous thing is those who think so hard they tangle themselves up in their stray thoughts, their idealistic views, and their fantasy worlds that they lose any ties to the real one and common sense.

Employees don't get paid half when business heads south, they get laid off. That has everything to do with supply and demand. If the customers don't want or need commodities or services, companies go bankrupt and the employees get the boot. That's the way business works.

There was a demand for AMC's. The lenders wanted one-stop shopping. There was a need and they filled it. That's capitalism at its best. They're no different than Wal-mart. Wal-mart has put a lot of other places out of business, but way too many people still shop there because they're cheap and anything you could want or need is right there. The other guys had to lower their fees to compete or give it up. The same applies to running an appraisal business. Lenders want low fees, one-stop shopping, and 24 hour turn-around-times. You go with what the customers want and where the customers are or you don't stay in business long.

There are too many appraisers out there competing for work. With that pick of the litter, AMC's get away with paying whatever they want. When supply and demand shifts the other way, then fee splits will go up. Until then, I don't foresee any changes except even lower fees. They're just playing general contractor in a field full of sub-contractors.

 

[Riick]

^^^
If what we are selling was merely merchandise that could be knocked-off,
Cheap, in China, then I would agree with the Wal-Mart analogy.
And, I must admit, that IS the way the Lenders are looking at things
- interchangeable cheap parts, interchangeable cheap appraisals, what's the difference?

However, as the losses posted by these same Lenders show
their corrupt ways cannot continue. THEY are going out of business.
(Example: IndyMac -- 52 week range $33.29 to last close at $1.45)
(Example: Look at list of failed Lenders at implode-o-meter.com)

What we are selling is supposed to be the antigen against corruption,
by outside parties.
Who would have ever thought our (protective) opinions would be sold to
customers who are corrupt themselves? Why would they buy them?

It's not a matter of simple Supply and Demand, it's a matter of Demand
-not just for fast & cheap- but demand for inflated values and blind eyes.

Soon, Lenders will be forced to stop being cowboys and become
"prudent" again, not by the government (that won't happen),
but by their own investors, who are now 2 years into losing large amounts.

Opinion based on basic economics:

No one can stay in the money-lending business
loaning money to people who can't pay it back,
and who offer collateral that gives the lender no
chance of recovering the majority of the principle
after default.

 

[c w d]

<| Truth doesn’t exist if it involves Government or Big Business; especially if it involves Both |>

Riick, I want credit for my quote you're using. Either that or a monthly check at $.25 per use.

You're preaching to the choir. Hell we all are. It comes down to one simple fact. Noone outside of the appraisal industry cares. They don't want to hear it. The way things are currently are exactly how they want them. It's why I'm getting out. Appraisers have always been and will always be manipulated. With the new improved low fees because somehow we're supposed to be able to do our appraisals faster and more efficiently even when more and more is being asked of us it's guaranteed to make us submit to our clients' collective will...."give us the number we want, please.....or else". It's why I'm getting out.

Speaking of doing appraisals faster here's a story: My mother being in the mortgage business for most of her life used an appraiser with whom they became life long friends. She tells me now that he used to do 60+ appraisals a month for her back in the day in the '80's. And she was just one of his many clients. And he didn't have a sweat shop. I don't know what he was capable of producing overall in a month. But, I would be extremely hard pressed to complete 60 appraisal in a month now. Thats almost 3 appraisals a day in a 5 day work week. And that was before computers supposedly increased our productivity, digital photos, email, cell phones, the internet, etc, etc, etc. We are doing more work for less pay. Period!

 

[Esox]

Indymac Bank going out of business is one thing. Check this out. Could be Bear Stearns all over again, only much, much, bigger.

http://www.cnbc.com//id/25161379?__source=yahoo%7Cheadline%7Cquote%7Ctext%7C&par=yahoo

Think the Fed has a few more bucks laying around to help out Lehman Brothers?

Kevin

 

[Blueprint]

Lets just have every appraiser that got their license in the past five years be suspended form doing business. That will ease the supply and demand problem causing fees to rise.

I am there on that, as a whole. The only prob is I received my hard earned license 1 year ago, and my hard earned certification, 1/2 year ago. I must be your evil twin, with all of my excellence. I am here, stealing your hard earned fees.

 

[Chelley Bahner]

No one can stay in the money-lending business
loaning money to people who can't pay it back,
and who offer collateral that gives the lender no
chance of recovering the majority of the principle
after default.

...and hence no lenders, no clients, too many appraisers, lower fees, and happy AMC's. Supply and demand.

 

[Chelley Bahner]

Soon, Lenders will be forced to stop being cowboys and become
"prudent" again, not by the government (that won't happen),
but by their own investors, who are now 2 years into losing large amounts.

This is why they're going straight to AMC's and not accepting appraisals from mortgage brokers or appraisers directly. They really think AMC's have something to offer as far as value pressure and appraiser oversight.

And with so many lenders out of it and fewer and fewer hanging on, our numbers are left with nothing but the scraps the AMC's throw.

 

[Riick]

No one can stay in the money-lending business

loaning money to people who can't pay it back,
and who offer collateral that gives the lender no
chance of recovering the majority of the principle
after default.

...and hence no lenders, no clients, too many appraisers, lower fees, and happy AMC's. Supply and demand.

Well.. that may be one way to look at it.
(Hopefully, you have not been waking up thinking about suicide lately)

On the other hand, presumably the Lenders that survive did so by not
lending the way the others did, and just (perhaps?) depending upon truthful appraisal reports.
D'You think??

So then (given a fairly constant demand by borrowers) the logic chain would be:
Fewer lenders.
Ordering many more appraisals per lender.
Directing the appraisals to people they trust. ((Who don't work for peon wages.))

Followed by:
Happy Lenders making many profitable loans.
Appraisal Fees based on competition between honest appraisal businesses.
Oh.. and AMCs - just who needs them?

 

[Smokey Bear]

They really think AMC's have something to offer as far as value pressure and appraiser oversight.

Too true - we have evidence that Eape agreed to appraiser pressure on values and other issues with one bank - and were given permission to change value on some appraisals - by the bank. Capitalism doesn't include the illegal acts that have been so rampant as to destroy an industry and many others. Chelley - you need to dig a little deeper before making your assumptions that it's simply supply and demand - unless you just don't distinguish between doing business ethically and doing business any way you can just to make money.