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Another Meaningless Disclosure Law.

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Joe Birrell (NY)

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Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
One month ago NY instituted a property condition disclosure law. It is very detailed and in some points technical (beyond the knowledge of the typical property owner). It requires a "yes", "no", "unknown", or "N/A" response to a series of questions (4 pages long). It requires that the seller fully disclosure all sorts of information on title, environmental, structural, and mechanical aspects prior to contract signing. It is the equivalent of an FHA VC Sheet. The disclosure form indicates it is not a warranty of any kind, and not a substitution for inspections or tests. It does not apply to condos, coops, or new construction. It cannot be filled out by anybody but the seller. If the seller knowingly gives false info or an incomplete statement, they are subject to paying the buyer $500.

So far, the entire thing has been circumvented by the sellers attorneys.
Attorneys are telling the sellers not to fill out the form and pay the $500
at the closing. It seems it is cheaper than assuming any potential liability. Why bother with these absurd laws in the first place ?
 

Ray Ohler

Sophomore Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
the "reasonably" honest people have to pay for the ones that will twist, turn, lie, cheat, steal, make up things and when it is all said and done, BLAME IT ON SOMEONE ELSE and that they were just a VICTIM. That's why. The general public, generally, doesn't have a clue about something they are not involved in on a daily basis. They have to rely on "experts". It is virtually impossible for even the "experts" to know every single little nuance about an issue unless they have direct experience with that nuance or can dig it out of someone who has. However, even THAT may not work in all situations. That's why certain "experts" specialize in one matter, be it a doctor, lawyer or whatever. You know how all the "personal injury" lawyers SCREAM at you on TV about how much money they can get you? Wait 'til you see the lawyers taking out TV ads SCREAMING "Was YOUR lender AT FAULT for using an incompetent or fraudulent appraiser? WE'LL get you BIG BUCKS." The class action suits? The people will get a COUPON for $250 off their NEXT mortgage application. The LAWYERS will get $82B.
 

Leon Stewart

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
We've had those "Seller disclosure" Statements in Ohio for Years, and I've never heard of anyone filing a complaint or if the State has the machinery to enforce these Statements. Most Sellers just lie out of habit, and if something happens afterwards they can always claim they didn't know about it, or that the defect was not there when they lived in the house.

All these changes in procedures don't mean nothing unless they require a Complete Home Inspection as a part of the Loan Process, especially on major components like, Plumbing, Heating, Electrical and Structural. Those items should be Certified as a part of the Sale, and backed by an insurance policy paid for by the seller.

leon
 

Farm Gal

Elite Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2002
Professional Status
Licensed Appraiser
State
Nebraska
Leon:

I am with you all the way up to the point where the seller should pay for the insurance... Hey why not? they are undoubtedly going to pick the most responsible and expensive firm, right? ---NOT!

How's about THIS???

Let the buyer pick the insurance firm, and then have the insurance firm pick the inspector...

What would you like to bet there would suddenly become a viable market for home inspectors, and that it would be self policing, as the users of those services would require experience or designation by a professional group on the part of of their inspectors, professional organizations for home inspectors would grow, but then....

Someone would decide that the profession/undustry should be regulated, and they will produce a simple document to set standards, and then to enforce those standards, they would develop a licensing proceedure..

(Oh right we have already seen this in action...) never mind.
 

Ray Ohler

Sophomore Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
right on the numbers. Wherever there is BIG money, BIG power OR ... nevermind, people run the show straight into the ground (and then some).
 

bobburnitt

Junior Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2002
Liberal politicians are all "utopian thinkers". They believe they can regulate or legislate anything into a utopia where no one is responsible for his own actions. Your citizens vote for them right and left. Best example: Brunhilda Clinton

BB in Texas
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
I built a house on my farm 10 years ago. Prior to moving in I sold a small economy home that was less than 18 mo. old in a subdivision of similar homes on an FHA assumption. Within 30 days the hot water tank sprang a leak. The new owners were very miffed. How could I have "disclosed" that a HW tank would last less than 19 months? Clearly no one expects a nearly new tank to fail, but if you are selling an old home, you could wind up in court because they can make the case that, gee it is old, so must be near failure.....oh?
Right o about lawyers. They are in court with everyone. If they can get it certified as class action, they make the big bucks...everyone of the class members might get a check for $14.
 

Larry Lyke

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2002
BB --

"Utopian thinkers" believe voters are free to vote their own mental capacity and pocketbook.

Utopia is a perfect political and social system, wherein everyone is responsibile for his and his brother's actions.

"Brunhilda" Clinton, as you refer to Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY), was raised to the pinnacle of respect by the voters of the state of New York the old-fashioned way, 'She earned it.' [Afect Mike Ditka]

Here's my interpretation of your thesis: 'Dat's wha ya git for a edjakatin women!'
 

Leon Stewart

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2002
Lee Ann:

That system would work, but I do have a slight problem with Insurance Companies selecting the Inspectors. That's what has created most of the problems in the Appraisal Profession where they allow the Lenders to select the Appraisers. You could end up with a similar situation and the Inspectors will meet the needs of the Insurance Company that selected them, or who is giving them most of their work.

The "Conflict of Interest" situation should be eliminated at all cost. Otherwise the system is doomed for failure. Any System that is created has to be constructed so that no one could rubberstamp their own deal. That in itself makes the so called objective Report worthless.

leon
 

Farm Gal

Elite Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2002
Professional Status
Licensed Appraiser
State
Nebraska
Leon:

If however the insurance companies 'acceptable losses' exceeded what thier risk management team considered reasonable they would start eliminating the loss producers: inspectors who do not meet their range of loss criteria...

This is what may/will eventually occurr (again) in the appraisal business IF the losses are significant enough to result in unacceptable risk for the golden players!
 
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