C1 or C2

[J Grant]

Well....is the purchase price in-line with other C-1, new construction sales? (Ones not 9 months old). Did the selling agent reveal any backup offers?

I would think the market would dictate whether it's a C1 or a C2 based on the price they were willing to pay. Sure, we have to give it a uad rating however, the market's offerings is where the rubber meets the road.

it is not about how the market values it; it is about what physically exists. ( C 1 or C @ )

They might sell the same $ as each other, or the market may pay more or less for either choice, but it the question is which to assign pre the UAD for what physically is there -

 

[Surf Cat]

it is not about how the market values it; it is about what physically exists. ( C 1 or C @ )

They might sell the same $ as each other, or the market may pay more or less for either choice, but it the question is which to assign pre the UAD for what physically is there -

I respectfully disagree. And I'll tell you why.

This is most likely for an AMC. Therefore, you have to play the AMC game. Even though Fannie says you can make an adjustment for condition for two sales with identical uad condition ratings, in reality, that throws up red flags and a automatic stip from AMC's.

Example; 2 sales per the UAD ratings description are considered C3 however, one of sales has a feature or an amenity that the other one doesn't which, is reflected in the sales price. I don't insert a + or - adjustment in the condition rating slot....I'll enter it as a separate line item adjustment where you can custom shop it towards the bottom of the grid.

Therefore, if the subject is under contract for a price in line with new, C1 properties, I would call it a C1. Conversely, if the subject is under contract for say, 75k less than the C1 comps, I would consider it a C2 and explain. Is that strictly, by the book, per the uad description? Maybe not..... but I don't care, because I understand there's a lot of gray area between the C ratings. I'm not wrong either way because the market told me so....

I've been thrown over the handlebars plenty of times with the AMC stick in the spokes. Play the game or bang your head on the desk answering to stips.

 

[J Grant]

I respectfully disagree. And I'll tell you why.

This is most likely for an AMC. Therefore, you have to play the AMC game. Even though Fannie says you can make an adjustment for condition for two sales with identical uad condition ratings, in reality, that throws up red flags and a automatic stip from AMC's.

Example; 2 sales per the UAD ratings description are considered C3 however, one of sales has a feature or an amenity that the other one doesn't which, is reflected in the sales price. I don't insert a + or - adjustment in the condition rating slot....I'll enter it as a separate line item adjustment where you can custom shop it towards the bottom of the grid.

Therefore, if the subject is under contract for a price in line with new, C1 properties, I would call it a C1. Conversely, if the subject is under contract for say, 75k less than the C1 comps, I would consider it a C2 and explain. Is that strictly, by the book, per the uad description? Maybe not..... but I don't care, because I understand there's a lot of gray area between the C ratings. I'm not wrong either way because the market told me so....

I've been thrown over the handlebars plenty of times with the AMC stick in the spokes. Play the game or bang your head on the desk answering to stips.

I don't play AMC games; if I do an appraisal for them, I do it as I would for any other client.

if the market shows no adjustment for C 1 vs C 2, then put in zero and explain why. Don;t fudge and call one the wrong condition to get out of it. That

 

[J Grant]

I don't play AMC games; if I do an appraisal for them, I do it as I would for any other client.

if the market shows no adjustment for C 1 vs C 2, then put in zero and explain why. Don;t fudge and call one the wrong condition to get out of it. That

I respectfully disagree. And I'll tell you why.

This is most likely for an AMC. Therefore, you have to play the AMC game. Even though Fannie says you can make an adjustment for condition for two sales with identical uad condition ratings, in reality, that throws up red flags and a automatic stip from AMC's.

Example; 2 sales per the UAD ratings description are considered C3 however, one of sales has a feature or an amenity that the other one doesn't which, is reflected in the sales price. I don't insert a + or - adjustment in the condition rating slot....I'll enter it as a separate line item adjustment where you can custom shop it towards the bottom of the grid.

Therefore, if the subject is under contract for a price in line with new, C1 properties, I would call it a C1. Conversely, if the subject is under contract for say, 75k less than the C1 comps, I would consider it a C2 and explain. Is that strictly, by the book, per the uad description? Maybe not..... but I don't care, because I understand there's a lot of gray area between the C ratings. I'm not wrong either way because the market told me so....

I've been thrown over the handlebars plenty of times with the AMC stick in the spokes. Play the game or bang your head on the desk answering to stips.

You are wrong because the market or price does not decide a UAD condition rating; the appraiser's observations of which condition is met physically for which rating decide the UAD rating.

I add a line item adjustment for upgrades, often for houses in the same UAD condition, but if an appraiser wants to make the adjustment on the condition line of one being superior, then make it there and explain why.

 

[Surf Cat]

You are wrong because the market or price does not decide a UAD condition rating; the appraiser's observations of which condition is met physically for which rating decide the UAD rating.

Nope, I would be right either way given "my" explanation.

You know, you can label it C2 and make no adjustments for it being in like/new condition.

Look at Tim's answer above....one could do that.

Or, you can go with Tom's new car analogy. That wouldn't be wrong.

c1, never lived in. car was never driven off the dealer parking lot.

It's in the gray area between the C1 and C2 ratings. It could go either way. Look, even you state it...

The house was sitting out in the weather for 9 months and it is no longer a brand new C 1. It is also now a resale, not direct from a builder like the other C 1 in the community would be. C 2 and explain.

Therefore, I would make my determination of which rating based upon the market reaction of what the market participants are willing to pay as I originally stated.

Granted, we weren't there and we don't have all of the pertinent details by the OP. We are just discussing and therefore, I'm not wrong.

 

[BRCJR]

C 1.5

 

[Fernando]

UAD has diverted appraisers with the silly details than concentrating on appraised value.
Same for reviewers just looking at the details than the important stuff like getting appropriate comps.

 

[J Grant]

Nope, I would be right either way given "my" explanation.

Look at Tim's answer above....one could do that.

Or, you can go with Tom's new car analogy. That wouldn't be wrong.


It's in the gray area between the C1 and C2 ratings. It could go either way. Look, even you state it...


Therefore, I would make my determination of which rating based upon the market reaction of what the market participants are willing to pay as I originally stated.

Granted, we weren't there and we don't have all of the pertinent details by the OP. We are just discussing and therefore, I'm not wrong.

But "your" explanaiotn is wrong !! It wrong because C 1 or C 2 relates to property conditions, and the rating is absolute to the property, not relative to price or market preference,

Of course, there is a gray area regarding the number of months since construction or whether any depreciation happened in C 1 vs. C 2, but again, this is about the property condition, not how the market reacts in price.

The market price reactions and adjustments is the valuation applied to the UAD rating - maybe the market pays the same as for C 2 and a C 1,it varies per area, but we do not change our rating because of it. We state the market is not reacting in price for C 1 vs C 2, or the market is reacting in price fo C 1 vs C 2.

 

[alebrewer]

I've always treated 'not lived in' as C1, as that is the very clear UAD definition. IF the market penalizes properties for not being new, that would be an age adjustment. At the end of the day, though, I seriously doubt anyone's feet are going to be held to the fire either way - just splain what you're doing and why.

 

[Dublin ohio]

Even though Fannie says you can make an adjustment for condition for two sales with identical uad condition ratings, in reality, that throws up red flags and a automatic stip from AMC's.

My experience has been the exact opposite. All of my clients want the condition adjustment on the condition line. Even when I use the same condition rating and make an adjustment (with explanation of course).