Certified General Appraisers Pay Range

[PL1957]

I just noticed one of the top producers at CBRE in northern California (award winning 10 years ago), finally let his license expire and is now a "Site Manager" at a large software company in the SF Bay Area. I remember a VP at CBRE back then trying to convince me that this particular appraiser had actually earned $700K in one year. What BS! I would say maybe $700K in billings with a couple of very good trainees and very long hours was more like it. And he must of had the right connections to get the most profitable jobs. Apparently it didn't last forever. And the Appraisal Institute's latest salary stats? If you can get yourself positioned in the right spot at Valbridge or CBRE, i.e. able to get the profitable assignments channeled to you, get good analysts and trainees under you, then $150K- $200K is possible with 60+ hours /week. But, there are plenty of 40 hour week jobs around the Silicon Valley that pay $150K plus good benefits - and you don't have to deal with the liability and license issues.

I’ve been in the national firm space since 1991, except for an 8 year hiatus in the late 1990’s-early 2000s.

Instead of adding to uniformed rumors and speculation, if someone is seriously evaluating a position at a national firm, feel free to PM me.

 

[RCA]

I’ve been in the national firm space since 1991, except for an 8 year hiatus in the late 1990’s-early 2000s.

Instead of adding to uniformed rumors and speculation, if someone is seriously evaluating a position at a national firm, feel free to PM me.

There is nothing uninformed or speculative about my statements, if that is what you are implying. Most others on this subject say pretty much the same - UNLESS THEY ARE LOOKING FOR RECRUITS.

There have been "flights" of recruits to national firms with horrendous results. I remember back around 2003-5 period when CBRE down in LA was hiring tons of trainees with ridiculous promises. The vast majority became disillusioned and left after a period of time. This was all pretty well documented; I would assume the personal recounts and stories are still somewhere on the internet. When I started, I was fed a lot of BS by more than one firm. I always hate to relate my own personal experience because some supervisors are responsible, while others or not. And when you say something negative, without giving names, you kind of implicate everyone. But, you can't give out names. That's unfortunate.

Have things changed? Well .... From what I've heard in recent AI classes, things are much worse! At least in California. Statements like "trainees are lucky if they even get a 25% split. ......

It is just too easy to pull the rug out from under anyone in the profession working on splits, by withholding profitable work, or rather handing out the problematic time-consuming appraisals, - when you have absolute control of the workflow.

Unless there is a very firm policy in place for handling workflow that is fair and honest - and transparent, you shouldn't work for a national firm, except with a fixed salary, plus bonus.

 

[RCA]

$150k in Silicon Valley = living in a cardboard box

-----
$56-85k annual at the state level for a CG, and includes the obvious benefits absent to independent fee work.
37.5 hours a week for a state position, which in my opinion, qualifies as part time hours.
I've seen similar federal positions offering another 15%-20% on the salary with slightly superior benefits.

If you are making $150K/year and your spouse maybe $100K/year, you are doing OK. If you are married for a number of years, you probably have income coming in from several sources. If your house is paid off .... No. $150K/yr is decent and really at the higher end for software developers in the area. Of course, the exceptionally talented make much higher salaries - if they are in the right area.

 

[Michigan CG]

.... From what I've heard in recent AI classes, things are much worse!

I have talked to people who work in commercial fee shops like CBRE (and actual CBRE people) in the past. Here is what I know (or think I know):
-They have vast databases of comps,
-Trainees are surrounded with people who have vast amounts of knowledge to assist,
-They are paid full benefits,
-They have templates for every type of commercial property;
-They provide significant clerical assistance,
-They subscribe to all of the databases that some small shops can't afford.

Let us say the average fee is driven down to $2,000 and the trainee gets 25%. With the tools in place the trainee should be able to write two reports a week which is $1,000 per week. Not bad for a guy who is being given an education along with the other benefits. Once one has a license they can write three a week? At a 40% split and the same assumed (low) $2,000 fee that is $2,400/week or about $125,000/year.

No one is starving at those shops.

 

[Michigan CG]

If you are making $150K/year and your spouse maybe $100K/year, you are doing OK.

A married couple making $250k per year is in the top 5% of all families in the United States.

 

[RCA]

A married couple making $250k per year is in the top 5% of all families in the United States.

That is probably a good average salary for a couple in the SF Bay Area, both working in tech. Anything under $180K combined would be kind of on the low side.

Of course many earn much less. Somehow you can live here driving an Uber and working at McDonalds. You can rent a room for $900/month, never have any fun, eat, sleep, go to work, day in day out, week after week. Yea, not much of a life. But that is what some do. Some live with their parents or friends.

 

[Skeletor]

$200-$250 in billings and 40%-50% split.

Very interesting topic indeed. I, too, am in agreement regarding the billings range, but I don't know about that fee split. I worked for three appraisal firms before starting my own appraisal company. The first firm was commercial only and my split was 35% after I earned my CG. The second firm was also commercial only and that split was 33% (IRR by the way - just a really bad company in my opinion). The last firm I worked for was residential only and that split was 43%. I've been in the business for 14 years and I started my own firm after 10 years of practice. In a nutshell, I became disillusioned with the compensation considering how much time and effort I've had to put in to become a quality appraiser. It's hard to get ahead financially with those types of fee splits, not to mention the ongoing liability which your employer does not absorb in the slightest. These appraisal firms take way too much profit away from their employed appraisers. So I put my money where my mouth is and started my own.

After expenses, for independent appraisers, you should be clearing about 60% - 65% before taxes on $200k to $250k in billings and one trainee at a 50% fee split if you can manage a low overhead operation. It's a decent living and rewarding if you enjoy practicing appraisal and have a good working knowledge of how to manage a business.

 

[RCA]

I have talked to people who work in commercial fee shops like CBRE (and actual CBRE people) in the past. Here is what I know (or think I know):
-They have vast databases of comps,
-Trainees are surrounded with people who have vast amounts of knowledge to assist,
-They are paid full benefits,
-They have templates for every type of commercial property;
-They provide significant clerical assistance,
-They subscribe to all of the databases that some small shops can't afford.

Let us say the average fee is driven down to $2,000 and the trainee gets 25%. With the tools in place the trainee should be able to write two reports a week which is $1,000 per week. Not bad for a guy who is being given an education along with the other benefits. Once one has a license they can write three a week? At a 40% split and the same assumed (low) $2,000 fee that is $2,400/week or about $125,000/year.

No one is starving at those shops.

Ha, ha. What planet do you come from? I remember the first assignment I had. It was a failed appraisal that a couple of MAIs had worked on going back a couple of years. Total trash almost. I thought they must have been smoking something. I thought - two years ago they must have gone through a phase where all 25% or so of the MAIs were smoking pot. - High end housing development on the waterfront. Lots of problems. It was a good experience for me. Back then we had all the databases, forms, templates ---- experienced appraisers typically spent two weeks on an appraisal. Now there has been some progress since then for sure. Especially with multi-family. And, I'm sure that they have improved their workflow in many respects.

So, what I have heard this past half year, coming back into the profession after retiring from software development last year, is that the competition is fierce, rates are lower, and especially splits for experienced trainees. Some commercial appraisers are moving to residential! I guess the idea of working on a steady stream of hybrids for $100K/year is appealing to some.

Now having said that, I do believe that valuation, as a profession is a very long ways from dead. It should have a very promising future - it is just that we have to expand beyond real estate valuation to the more more generic "measurement and valuation" field as a profession.

 

[Elliott]

Glad I don't wear a skirt.

 

[Gobears81]

Very interesting topic indeed. I, too, am in agreement regarding the billings range, but I don't know about that fee split. I worked for three appraisal firms before starting my own appraisal company. The first firm was commercial only and my split was 35% after I earned my CG. The second firm was also commercial only and that split was 33% (IRR by the way - just a really bad company in my opinion). The last firm I worked for was residential only and that split was 43%. I've been in the business for 14 years and I started my own firm after 10 years of practice. In a nutshell, I became disillusioned with the compensation considering how much time and effort I've had to put in to become a quality appraiser. It's hard to get ahead financially with those types of fee splits, not to mention the ongoing liability which your employer does not absorb in the slightest. These appraisal firms take way too much profit away from their employed appraisers. So I put my money where my mouth is and started my own.

After expenses, for independent appraisers, you should be clearing about 60% - 65% before taxes on $200k to $250k in billings and one trainee at a 50% fee split if you can manage a low overhead operation. It's a decent living and rewarding if you enjoy practicing appraisal and have a good working knowledge of how to manage a business.

There's a lot of variables there. Experience is a big one, and bringing in business has an effect on that split too. Benefits are massive reason for variance, as paying 35% and full benefits to one appraiser might not really differ from 50% to another appraiser where the "benefits" are MLS access and an office to type reports, if that. Maybe those %s could be disputed, but just throwing that out as an example. I made a salary that averaged in the low 20%s (and full benefits) for the first +/- 7 years of my career, which includes four years as a CG. That sounds like highway robbery and I certainly thought it was low at the time. But, I didn't bring in any of the business myself during that time and all of my appraisals were co-signed since I didn't have an MAI. I now get 50%, but have an MAI and basically operate a separate office where I bring in 95%+ of the appraisals that come across my desk.