Fire wall in the garage for FHA?

[William K]

It is an existing structure.
I think it was built in 1997.

So if he put that in the report underwriting may not make us do anything????

I would argue it is not an FHA- REQUIREMENT, and FHA Does not require the appraiser to be CODE Enforcement.
AN appraiser attempting to argue that it's a "Safety Issue" under the 3-S's ( Safe, Sound and Secure) would be really stretching it, IMHO.

As an example-
Most wiring in homes built before 1970 do not meet the New Construction building codes of today, yet as appraisers we don't require they be brought up to todays New Construction Code Standards because of potential safety issues. FHA doesn't even require GFI's in existing structures and that is a far bigger potential "safety" hazard.

 

[Bearslide]

This is directly from an email communication with the National Service Centerr last year, referencing a built in garage adjacent to a forced warm air furnace.

"In regards to your question does a built in garage which does not have any firewall present a safety hazard when the forced warm air furnace is within 10 feet of the parking area the answer is yes. There is a potential hazard with the arrangement due to fire and carbon monoxide. FHA requires all safety hazards to be repaired in order for the property to comply with FHA minimum property standards. The appraisal should be conditioned upon the installation of a firewall to separate the garage area from the basement. This should also include any portions of the garage area which are exposed to living area. In addition, if a door is installed it should also be a fire rated door. I would suggest you contact the local building department for their building code requirements.

If you have any further questions please contact our office."

 

[Mike Kennedy]

FHA 4150/.2

(3-6) 2. Hazards
The property must be free of all known hazards and
adverse conditions that:
o may affect the health and safety of the occupants
o may affect the structural soundness of the
improvements
o may impair the customary use and enjoyment of the
property
These hazards include toxic chemicals, radioactive
materials, other pollution, hazardous activities,
potential damage from soil or other differential ground
movements, ground water, inadequate surface drainage,
flood, erosion, excessive noise and other hazards on or
off site.

1. The FHA Resource Center. The Resource Center will be open and available to assist clients with FHA-related calls (800-225-5342) and emails (answers@HUD.gov) during its normal business hours of 8:00 AM to 8:00 PM Eastern. Please note that Resource Center staff will be unable to escalate policy clarification or case specific questions to HUD employees on furlough days. Clients will be required to call back on the next business day to seek escalation once HUD Offices have re-opened.
   

 

[Mike Kennedy]

PRIOR A-FORUM DISCUSSIONS ON TOPIC

http://appraisersforum.com/showpost.php?p=793571&postcount=8

http://appraisersforum.com/showpost.php?p=2223609&postcount=11

 

[sputnam]

Most codes simply require thicker drywall on any garage walls/ceiling that are adjacent to living area.

 

[RSW]

HUD allows any requirement that, in the appraiser's opinion, affects the "3 S's". Safety, Soundness and Security. I'm guessing that he/she determined that this is an issue.

As always, it is the UNDERWRITER that determines what, if anything, needs to be done. He/she can ALWAYS waive any requirement.

In that case, the appraiser had better have a good knowledge of all building codes. He/she can't pick and choose what code violations to be reported.

 

[Mike Garrett RAA]

Another fine reason....

 

[Proactive]

In that case, the appraiser had better have a good knowledge of all building codes. He/she can't pick and choose what code violations to be reported.

We are not code enforcers. However, in the instance of the wall between the house and attached garage, if the residence attic is open and exposed to the garage area, it is a safety issue, IMHO. Just ask any home inspector. Installation of a firewall (5/8" drywall, taped) installed from the top of the concrete foundation wall up to the roof sheathing, will correct it. I have recommended this correction in the past, and will continue to do so.

No, the HUD handbooks do not address garage firewalls, just as they do not spell out each and every residential health and safety issue known to man.

It's not code enforcement. It's common sense.

OP: Your forum status indicates you are a real estate agent. Is your question related to a sales transaction, and are you representing the seller, or the buyer? Just curious...

 

[Mr Rex]

Just don't call it as a code violation, call it a health and safety concern. As a NC Home Inspector, if I cite "code" I have to provide the chapter and verse in my report and provide a copy of the text from the code book as an attachment to my HI report.

 

[Buzzz]

We are not code enforcers. However, in the instance of the wall between the house and attached garage, if the residence attic is open and exposed to the garage area, it is a safety issue, IMHO. Just ask any home inspector. Installation of a firewall (5/8" drywall, taped) installed from the top of the concrete foundation wall up to the roof sheathing, will correct it. I have recommended this correction in the past, and will continue to do so.

No, the HUD handbooks do not address garage firewalls, just as they do not spell out each and every residential health and safety issue known to man.

It's not code enforcement. It's common sense.

OP: Your forum status indicates you are a real estate agent. Is your question related to a sales transaction, and are you representing the seller, or the buyer? Just curious...

And yes it is related to a sales transaction.
I have the buyer.
The lender has never had this come up before.
And the selling agent has never had this come up before.
I have 18 years construction experience so I know a little about firewalls.

It just seems like if an APPRAISER notes that something needs to be corrected, they should be able to tell you what needs to be done.
The garage has OSB on the walls, but he wants a firewall. He said that the ceiling needs to be covered, but doesn't know what with.

For it to be a true firewall it would need drywall on the ceiling and walls and even a firedoor.

So my question is What needs to be done in the garage for a FHA loan???

Thanks for all of the replies.......